4 ms·

Is forking really possible with an LLM or one the size of future Lama versions, have they even released the weights and everything? Maybe I am just negative abo

Is forking really possible with an LLM or one the size of future Lama versions, have they even released the weights and everything? Maybe I am just negative about it because I feel Meta is the worst company ever invented and feel this will hurt society in the long run just like Facebook.

lawlessone 2y ago
> have they even released the weights? Isn't that what the model is? just a collection weights?
pmarreck 2y ago
When you run `ollama pull llama3.1:70b`, which you can literally do right now (assuming ollama.com is installed and you're not afraid of the terminal), and it downloads a 40 gigabyte model, that is the weights! I'd consider the ability to admit when even your most hated adversary is doing something right, a hallmark of acting smarter. Now, they haven't released the training data with the model weights. THAT plus the training tooling would be "end to end open source". Apple actually did that very thing recently, and it flew under almost everyone's radar for some reason: https://x.com/vaishaal/status/1813956553042711006?s=46&t=qWag1P6krA-5zkoLCeptNw https://x.com/vaishaal/status/1813956553042711006?s=46&t=qWa...
- mym1990 2y ago
  Doing something right vs doing something that seems right but has a hidden self interest that is harmful in the long run can be vastly different things. Often this kind of strategy will allow people to let their guard down, and those same people will get steamrolled down the road, left wondering where it all went wrong. Get smarter.
  - pmarreck 2y ago
    How in the heck is an open source model that is free and open today going to lock me down, down the line? This is nonsense. You can literally run this model forever if you use NixOS (or never touch your windows, macos or linux install again). Zuck can't come back and molest it. Ever. The best I can tell is that their self-interest here is more about gathering mindshare. That's not a terrible motive; in fact, that's a pretty decent one. It's not the bully pressing you into their ecosystem with a tit-for-tat; it's the nerd showing off his latest and going "Here. Try it. Join me. Join us."
    - mym1990 2y ago
      Yeah because history isn't absolutely littered with examples of shiny things being dangled in front of people with the intent to entrap them /s. Can you really say this model will still be useful in 2 years, 5 years for you? And that FB's stance on these models will still be open source at that time once they incrementally make improvements? Maybe, maybe not. But FB doesn't give anything away for free, and the fact that you think so is your blindness, not mine. In case you haven't figured it out, this isn't a technology problem, this is a "FB needs marketshare and it needs it fast" problem.
      - pmarreck 2y ago
        > But FB doesn't give anything away for free, and the fact that you think so is your blindness, not mine Is it, though? They are literally giving this away "for free". https://dev.to/llm_explorer/llama3-license-explained-2915 https://dev.to/llm_explorer/llama3-license-explained-2915 Unless you build a service with it that has over 700 million monthly users (read: "problem anyone would love to have"), you do not have to re-negotiate a license agreement with them. Beyond that, it can't "phone home" or do any other sorts of nefarious shite. The other limitations there, which you can plainly read, seem not very restrictive. Is there a magic secret clause conspiracy buried within the license agreement that you believe will be magically pulled out at the worst possible moment? >..< Sometimes, good things happen. Sorry you're "too blinded" by past hurt experience to see that, I guess
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
    - troupo 2y ago
      > How in the heck is an open source model that is free and open today Is free, but it's not open source
- deleted 2y ago
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lawlessone 2y ago

> have they even released the weights? Isn't that what the model is? just a collection weights?

pmarreck 2y ago

When you run `ollama pull llama3.1:70b`, which you can literally do right now (assuming ollama.com is installed and you're not afraid of the terminal), and it downloads a 40 gigabyte model, that is the weights! I'd consider the ability to admit when even your most hated adversary is doing something right, a hallmark of acting smarter. Now, they haven't released the training data with the model weights. THAT plus the training tooling would be "end to end open source". Apple actually did that very thing recently, and it flew under almost everyone's radar for some reason: https://x.com/vaishaal/status/1813956553042711006?s=46&t=qWag1P6krA-5zkoLCeptNw https://x.com/vaishaal/status/1813956553042711006?s=46&t=qWa...

mym1990 2y ago
Doing something right vs doing something that seems right but has a hidden self interest that is harmful in the long run can be vastly different things. Often this kind of strategy will allow people to let their guard down, and those same people will get steamrolled down the road, left wondering where it all went wrong. Get smarter.
- pmarreck 2y ago
  How in the heck is an open source model that is free and open today going to lock me down, down the line? This is nonsense. You can literally run this model forever if you use NixOS (or never touch your windows, macos or linux install again). Zuck can't come back and molest it. Ever. The best I can tell is that their self-interest here is more about gathering mindshare. That's not a terrible motive; in fact, that's a pretty decent one. It's not the bully pressing you into their ecosystem with a tit-for-tat; it's the nerd showing off his latest and going "Here. Try it. Join me. Join us."
  - mym1990 2y ago
    Yeah because history isn't absolutely littered with examples of shiny things being dangled in front of people with the intent to entrap them /s. Can you really say this model will still be useful in 2 years, 5 years for you? And that FB's stance on these models will still be open source at that time once they incrementally make improvements? Maybe, maybe not. But FB doesn't give anything away for free, and the fact that you think so is your blindness, not mine. In case you haven't figured it out, this isn't a technology problem, this is a "FB needs marketshare and it needs it fast" problem.
    - pmarreck 2y ago
      > But FB doesn't give anything away for free, and the fact that you think so is your blindness, not mine Is it, though? They are literally giving this away "for free". https://dev.to/llm_explorer/llama3-license-explained-2915 https://dev.to/llm_explorer/llama3-license-explained-2915 Unless you build a service with it that has over 700 million monthly users (read: "problem anyone would love to have"), you do not have to re-negotiate a license agreement with them. Beyond that, it can't "phone home" or do any other sorts of nefarious shite. The other limitations there, which you can plainly read, seem not very restrictive. Is there a magic secret clause conspiracy buried within the license agreement that you believe will be magically pulled out at the worst possible moment? >..< Sometimes, good things happen. Sorry you're "too blinded" by past hurt experience to see that, I guess
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - troupo 2y ago
    > How in the heck is an open source model that is free and open today Is free, but it's not open source
deleted 2y ago
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