7 ms·

Chargeback - goods not as described. No need to return them.

dylan604 2y ago
Supposedly, card processors are meant to suspend accounts when they get too many chargebacks. How is that number determined? If it's a percentage of total charges, then places like Amazon/Ali* will have so many other charges these will pretty much round to zero. Also, these vendors are "too big to suspend", so chargebacks will do nothing like what they are meant to.
- mynameisvlad 2y ago
  What do you mean they don’t do what they’re supposed to? They get you your money back. That’s what they’re supposed to do. Dropping the merchant is a bonus.
  - dylan604 2y ago
    The chargeback is meant as last resort though when a company is not cooperating. The company has already been refunding without having to do a chargeback. The chargeback is meant to let the processor know that their customer isn't holding up their end of the agreement.
    - mynameisvlad 2y ago
      You're correct that it's a last resort, but its primary role is to, literally, charge back to the original merchant. "[letting] the processor know that their customer isn't holding up to their end of the agreement" is a side benefit. As is eventually dropping the merchant when there are too many chargebacks to justify supporting them. > Through a chargeback, your bank can try to get your money back from the seller on your behalf it isn’t a legal right, but your bank is committed to helping you, and will treat any claim fairly. https://www.visa.co.uk/how-you-pay-matters/chargeback-purchase-disputes.html https://www.visa.co.uk/how-you-pay-matters/chargeback-purcha... > When a customer disputes a debit or credit card transaction, the card issuer must determine whether to provide that cardholder with a refund for the transaction amount—also known as a chargeback. https://b2b.mastercard.com/news-and-insights/blog/what-is-a-chargeback/ https://b2b.mastercard.com/news-and-insights/blog/what-is-a-... > A chargeback is a rules-based mechanism, with time-sensitive workflows, that enables the issuer and the acquirer to determine the financial liability of a disputed transaction. https://www.mastercard.us/content/dam/public/mastercardcom/na/global-site/documents/chargebacks-made-simple-guide.pdf https://www.mastercard.us/content/dam/public/mastercardcom/n... > A chargeback occurs when, after investigation of the dispute, we debit your account for the amount of the disputed transaction and credit the Card Member with this amount. https://www.americanexpress.com/au/merchant/chargebacks-and-fraud0.html https://www.americanexpress.com/au/merchant/chargebacks-and-... Notice none of them talk about it being a feedback mechanism. Because it's not. It's a refund mechanism used as a last resort.
      - dylan604 2y ago
        > It's a refund mechanism used as a last resort. you've just skipped over then entire part where the websites are freely refunding and not denying refund claims making the last resort of a chargeback entirely unnecessary
        mynameisvlad 2y ago
        You are commenting in a thread about chargebacks as an option. You are the one that claimed chargebacks aren’t doing what they’re meant to do. They are, you just don’t know what they’re meant to do. Whether or not a website does refunds on their own does not change the definition of a chargeback in any way shape or form.
        dylan604 2y ago
        Yes, you're so wrong. I've had merchant accounts before, and there is clear wording about the negative impacts of chargebacks. I've even done a chargeback as a consumer, and they asked me if I had already been in contact with the seller before making a claim. So the blind advice of making a chargeback claim before making a refund/RMA type of request with the seller is really out of order in the steps to take.
        mynameisvlad 2y ago
        Clearly the definitions from all three major processors, both from consumer and merchant documents, don’t mean anything. Your anecdotes are far more convincing, for sure. > So the blind advice of making a chargeback claim before making a refund/RMA type of request with the seller is really out of order in the steps to take. That wasn’t even your point in the first comment. It was that chargebacks don’t do what they say they do. Way to move the goalposts when your initial point was clearly proven wrong.

Supposedly, card processors are meant to suspend accounts when they get too many chargebacks. How is that number determined? If it's a percentage of total charges, then places like Amazon/Ali* will have so many other charges these will pretty much round to zero. Also, these vendors are "too big to suspend", so chargebacks will do nothing like what they are meant to.

mynameisvlad 2y ago
What do you mean they don’t do what they’re supposed to? They get you your money back. That’s what they’re supposed to do. Dropping the merchant is a bonus.
- dylan604 2y ago
  The chargeback is meant as last resort though when a company is not cooperating. The company has already been refunding without having to do a chargeback. The chargeback is meant to let the processor know that their customer isn't holding up their end of the agreement.
  - mynameisvlad 2y ago
    You're correct that it's a last resort, but its primary role is to, literally, charge back to the original merchant. "[letting] the processor know that their customer isn't holding up to their end of the agreement" is a side benefit. As is eventually dropping the merchant when there are too many chargebacks to justify supporting them. > Through a chargeback, your bank can try to get your money back from the seller on your behalf it isn’t a legal right, but your bank is committed to helping you, and will treat any claim fairly. https://www.visa.co.uk/how-you-pay-matters/chargeback-purchase-disputes.html https://www.visa.co.uk/how-you-pay-matters/chargeback-purcha... > When a customer disputes a debit or credit card transaction, the card issuer must determine whether to provide that cardholder with a refund for the transaction amount—also known as a chargeback. https://b2b.mastercard.com/news-and-insights/blog/what-is-a-chargeback/ https://b2b.mastercard.com/news-and-insights/blog/what-is-a-... > A chargeback is a rules-based mechanism, with time-sensitive workflows, that enables the issuer and the acquirer to determine the financial liability of a disputed transaction. https://www.mastercard.us/content/dam/public/mastercardcom/na/global-site/documents/chargebacks-made-simple-guide.pdf https://www.mastercard.us/content/dam/public/mastercardcom/n... > A chargeback occurs when, after investigation of the dispute, we debit your account for the amount of the disputed transaction and credit the Card Member with this amount. https://www.americanexpress.com/au/merchant/chargebacks-and-fraud0.html https://www.americanexpress.com/au/merchant/chargebacks-and-... Notice none of them talk about it being a feedback mechanism. Because it's not. It's a refund mechanism used as a last resort.
    - dylan604 2y ago
      > It's a refund mechanism used as a last resort. you've just skipped over then entire part where the websites are freely refunding and not denying refund claims making the last resort of a chargeback entirely unnecessary
      - mynameisvlad 2y ago
        You are commenting in a thread about chargebacks as an option. You are the one that claimed chargebacks aren’t doing what they’re meant to do. They are, you just don’t know what they’re meant to do. Whether or not a website does refunds on their own does not change the definition of a chargeback in any way shape or form.
        dylan604 2y ago
        Yes, you're so wrong. I've had merchant accounts before, and there is clear wording about the negative impacts of chargebacks. I've even done a chargeback as a consumer, and they asked me if I had already been in contact with the seller before making a claim. So the blind advice of making a chargeback claim before making a refund/RMA type of request with the seller is really out of order in the steps to take.
        mynameisvlad 2y ago
        Clearly the definitions from all three major processors, both from consumer and merchant documents, don’t mean anything. Your anecdotes are far more convincing, for sure. > So the blind advice of making a chargeback claim before making a refund/RMA type of request with the seller is really out of order in the steps to take. That wasn’t even your point in the first comment. It was that chargebacks don’t do what they say they do. Way to move the goalposts when your initial point was clearly proven wrong.