3 ms·

I'm not picky about the solution and of course it's a complex issue. - If a safe, reliable bus or train went to and from close to my house to close to the offi

I'm not picky about the solution and of course it's a complex issue. - If a safe, reliable bus or train went to and from close to my house to close to the office, I'd take it. Key is safe and reliable. - If the roads were designed with enough capacity and planning in mind such that groups of vehicles are not stuck driving 15 MPH on a 70 MPH speed limit stretch of highway for 30 minutes or longer every day, that'd be fine. - If zoning laws/tax laws/whatever were such that it would be easier to build away from yet close to city centers and have smaller or additional offices closer to where people live, that'd work for me. - If city apartments were in reach costwise or even somehow subsidized by my employer in an equitable way (don't really know how that would look), and crime was not an issue, I would consider moving within walking distance of my workplace.

jspash 2y ago
I'm just curious, what about your local bus and/or train is not safe? Do you mean it could crash at any moment? Or it is usually full of unsavoury characters?
- burnished 2y ago
  Probably the latter. There doesn't tend to be good enforcement of social norms and etiquette on public transit.
- johnnyanmac 2y ago
  Homeless people in my area (LA). I don't blame them individually at all, it's a societal issue that some at best got kicked out of their living spaces when rent doubled in the last 5 years. Or at worst were fed fentanyl and had their lives ruined just to line the pockets of some skeevy "medical company" (thank goodness they are having the books thrown at them). But regardless of fault, they aren't mostly just some people down on luck that at best ask for some change like in my childhood. enough are dangerous, unpredictable, and mentally unwell that public transportation is a non-trivial risk here.
- RiverCrochet 2y ago
  I don't have a local bus or train, what I provided were examples. > Do you mean it could crash at any moment? Or it is usually full of unsavoury characters? Both. Buses/trains should be secure places and properly maintained at all times.
skywhopper 2y ago
Unfortunately it’s not possible to build roads “with enough capacity” in major cities. Beyond a certain point, the geometry of space does not allow enough capacity to satisfy the needs, because growing the roads by enough to have capacity requires spreading things further apart, which means more traffic must go further, which means more cars on the road, and more lanes means more merging and lane-changing, which slows things down further.
stetrain 2y ago
> If the roads were designed with enough capacity and planning in mind such that groups of vehicles are not stuck driving 15 MPH on a 70 MPH speed limit stretch of highway for 30 minutes or longer every day, that'd be fine. If you build that, then more people see that there is a nice quick road between where they work and a place where they can buy a more affordable home. The road gains more commuters until the congestion returns. Your other suggestions are more scalable. If housing is expensive, there should be more, denser housing. If commutes are long, we should be zoning such that houses can be near workplaces, and conversely workplaces can be near housing. If you create pockets of higher density housing and workplaces, instead of only building large swaths of low density single-family residential, you can preserve the options to live in a city, a walkable town center, or a more quiet location, while still having dense enough groupings to make transit lines viable.

jspash 2y ago

I'm just curious, what about your local bus and/or train is not safe? Do you mean it could crash at any moment? Or it is usually full of unsavoury characters?

burnished 2y ago
Probably the latter. There doesn't tend to be good enforcement of social norms and etiquette on public transit.
johnnyanmac 2y ago
Homeless people in my area (LA). I don't blame them individually at all, it's a societal issue that some at best got kicked out of their living spaces when rent doubled in the last 5 years. Or at worst were fed fentanyl and had their lives ruined just to line the pockets of some skeevy "medical company" (thank goodness they are having the books thrown at them). But regardless of fault, they aren't mostly just some people down on luck that at best ask for some change like in my childhood. enough are dangerous, unpredictable, and mentally unwell that public transportation is a non-trivial risk here.
RiverCrochet 2y ago
I don't have a local bus or train, what I provided were examples. > Do you mean it could crash at any moment? Or it is usually full of unsavoury characters? Both. Buses/trains should be secure places and properly maintained at all times.

skywhopper 2y ago

Unfortunately it’s not possible to build roads “with enough capacity” in major cities. Beyond a certain point, the geometry of space does not allow enough capacity to satisfy the needs, because growing the roads by enough to have capacity requires spreading things further apart, which means more traffic must go further, which means more cars on the road, and more lanes means more merging and lane-changing, which slows things down further.

stetrain 2y ago

> If the roads were designed with enough capacity and planning in mind such that groups of vehicles are not stuck driving 15 MPH on a 70 MPH speed limit stretch of highway for 30 minutes or longer every day, that'd be fine. If you build that, then more people see that there is a nice quick road between where they work and a place where they can buy a more affordable home. The road gains more commuters until the congestion returns. Your other suggestions are more scalable. If housing is expensive, there should be more, denser housing. If commutes are long, we should be zoning such that houses can be near workplaces, and conversely workplaces can be near housing. If you create pockets of higher density housing and workplaces, instead of only building large swaths of low density single-family residential, you can preserve the options to live in a city, a walkable town center, or a more quiet location, while still having dense enough groupings to make transit lines viable.