4 ms·

So it's OK to hide the mess, by throwing everything from the living room into the closet, I guess? Not to mention, in the old days, that stuff was modtly in do

by b112 2y ago

So it's OK to hide the mess, by throwing everything from the living room into the closet, I guess? Not to mention, in the old days, that stuff was modtly in dot files. (Users install graphical file manager. User has file manager set to bizarrely show dotfiles by default. User gets mad at prior hidden "clutter". Now dotfiles hidden one dir down.)

wadim 2y ago
> So it's OK to hide the mess, by throwing everything from the living room into the closet, I guess? Yes? This is literally how every human in the world does it. You put your things, according to catrgories, into their respective room/cabinet. If somebody asks you where your sweaters are, you don't say "just search the ground", you say " in the closet". Same thing here. You don't have to guess where files are, you know by convention.
- b112 2y ago
  My counterpoint was merely that ~/.<programname> hid things, unless you did weird things. Like explicitly ask to see all hidden things. Having a file manager set to see all dotfiles by default, is like ripping all the doors off your closets.
  - NetOpWibby 2y ago
    Unsettling concept tbh
  - xelamonster 2y ago
    I don't think it's all that weird, it's one of the first things I'd do in any file manager and I make sure Windows Explorer shows me system files too. If never had to interact with the hidden config it would be one thing, but I very often do and I don't want extra friction in getting to them.
  - creshal 2y ago
    You're completely missing the point. ~/.programname is an unorganized mess, where someone stuff their dirty laundry, their trash, their food and their passport into the same closet. It doesn't matter if the closet is open or not, nobody but the mentally ill hoarder who created the mess can navigate it. ~/.(local|share|cache) means people put their food in the fridge, their trash into the bin and their sensitive documents in a fire proof safe. Which means other people can take care of basic tasks like taking out the trash and creating backups of their sensitive documents.
    - chippiewill 2y ago
      The one thing I despise about local|share|config is I never know which one they're using or what kind of nested hierarchy they're using that means I might have to search for the company name first. At least with the ~/.whatever system I can just start typing ~/.tool-name, hit tab and it'll show me the thing if it exists. If it's somewhere else I have to look it up.
      - account42 2y ago
        > The one thing I despise about local|share|config is I never know which one they're using or what kind of nested hierarchy they're using that means I might have to search for the company name first. This really only applies to badly ported Windows software like Unity engine games. There should be no hierarchy, just ~/.{local/share,config,etc.}/$application And nothing stops badly behaved software from deciding to use ~/.$CompanyName or heck I have even seen ~/My\ Documents/$CompanyName
      - creshal 2y ago
        It's not like ~/.whatever has ever been used consistently: - ~/.mozilla/firefox, but: ~/.thunderbird and ~/.pki/nssdb (gonna keep you on your toes!) - Java defaults to .full.package.name (on top of using .java, .openjfx, and others) - Fontconfig uses `fc-*` for its tools. Naturally, its config file used to be in ~/.fonts.conf.d before they finally accepted standard directories - arandr, as the name implies, uses .screenlayout - The sooner the .net ecosystem decides if it wants to use ~/.dotnet or ~/.mono, the better (humble suggestion: ~/..net)

by b112 2y ago

wadim 2y ago

> So it's OK to hide the mess, by throwing everything from the living room into the closet, I guess? Yes? This is literally how every human in the world does it. You put your things, according to catrgories, into their respective room/cabinet. If somebody asks you where your sweaters are, you don't say "just search the ground", you say " in the closet". Same thing here. You don't have to guess where files are, you know by convention.

b112 2y ago
My counterpoint was merely that ~/.<programname> hid things, unless you did weird things. Like explicitly ask to see all hidden things. Having a file manager set to see all dotfiles by default, is like ripping all the doors off your closets.
- NetOpWibby 2y ago
  Unsettling concept tbh
- xelamonster 2y ago
  I don't think it's all that weird, it's one of the first things I'd do in any file manager and I make sure Windows Explorer shows me system files too. If never had to interact with the hidden config it would be one thing, but I very often do and I don't want extra friction in getting to them.
- creshal 2y ago
  You're completely missing the point. ~/.programname is an unorganized mess, where someone stuff their dirty laundry, their trash, their food and their passport into the same closet. It doesn't matter if the closet is open or not, nobody but the mentally ill hoarder who created the mess can navigate it. ~/.(local|share|cache) means people put their food in the fridge, their trash into the bin and their sensitive documents in a fire proof safe. Which means other people can take care of basic tasks like taking out the trash and creating backups of their sensitive documents.
  - chippiewill 2y ago
    The one thing I despise about local|share|config is I never know which one they're using or what kind of nested hierarchy they're using that means I might have to search for the company name first. At least with the ~/.whatever system I can just start typing ~/.tool-name, hit tab and it'll show me the thing if it exists. If it's somewhere else I have to look it up.
    - account42 2y ago
      > The one thing I despise about local|share|config is I never know which one they're using or what kind of nested hierarchy they're using that means I might have to search for the company name first. This really only applies to badly ported Windows software like Unity engine games. There should be no hierarchy, just ~/.{local/share,config,etc.}/$application And nothing stops badly behaved software from deciding to use ~/.$CompanyName or heck I have even seen ~/My\ Documents/$CompanyName
    - creshal 2y ago
      It's not like ~/.whatever has ever been used consistently: - ~/.mozilla/firefox, but: ~/.thunderbird and ~/.pki/nssdb (gonna keep you on your toes!) - Java defaults to .full.package.name (on top of using .java, .openjfx, and others) - Fontconfig uses `fc-*` for its tools. Naturally, its config file used to be in ~/.fonts.conf.d before they finally accepted standard directories - arandr, as the name implies, uses .screenlayout - The sooner the .net ecosystem decides if it wants to use ~/.dotnet or ~/.mono, the better (humble suggestion: ~/..net)