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>I just learned that blatant racists are not a rarity in our corner of the world. That's what you get if you browse Twitter. Stay off mainstream Twitter for y

>I just learned that blatant racists are not a rarity in our corner of the world. That's what you get if you browse Twitter. Stay off mainstream Twitter for your own sanity. > Fortunately I haven't seen this on HN so far :) Here people just blame offshore workers for this bug or other such critical bugs, as if US workers don't make mistakes. Peoples' egos are just unbelievable. If it's not DEI developers, then it must be those filthy foreign programmers from developing nations responsible for poor quality software and I've even seen here mentioned that Windows worldwide dominance also be blamed on SW devs from developing nations for being too poor to own Macs. I despise this "holier than thou" mentality of some privileged tech workers.

shiroiushi 2y ago
>Windows worldwide dominance also be blamed on SW devs from developing nations for being too poor to own Macs. Linux has been a viable alternative for decades now for many tasks. This problem wasn't caused by a lack of money. If you want to blame someone for the dominance of Windows, blame corporations and managers, because they're the ones that have chosen it. SW devs from developing nations have only been doing what they perceived to be in their best economic interest.
- Rinzler89 2y ago
  >Linux has been a viable alternative for decades now for many tasks. For decades?! Maybe on the servers, but on PCs, hardly. Also, even if that may be the case now, it doesn't change the fact that at your job they'll most likely use Windows not Linux on the workstations. Linux is king on the servers, but PCs everywhere will mostly still be Windows, especially in corporate environments.
  - shiroiushi 2y ago
    >For decades?! Maybe on the servers, but on PCs, hardly. While it wasn't as easy as it is today, I've been running Linux on my home desktop since around 1999. It's never been that hard, and it did require more careful hardware selection (no, you can't just grab some random dirt-cheap piece-of-shit "winprinter" and expect it to work with Linux), but it's always been quite doable for anyone who claims to be skilled with computers. We're talking about IT workers here, not grandma. >at your job they'll most likely use Windows not Linux on the workstations This is exactly my point in my prior post.
    - Rinzler89 2y ago
      >I've been running Linux on my home desktop since around 1999 Personal anecdotes are not statistics or cases representative for the average user or business. What others do with their systems and their requirements and apps could be very different than yours. You think if Linux was that usable at everything in 1999 companies and individuals wouldn't have loves to use that instead of paying thousand of dollars to Microsoft? Just because you could set it up and use it in 1999 doesn't mean it was the norm. Some people know how to change their own oil while most don't and don't care to since they prefer to pay someone else to do it as they have other hobbies than learning to tinker with their car. Similarly some people like you like to thinker and find out how to get Linux to work in 1999 while most prefer to just pay to use Windows NT/MacOS and get to work.
      - shiroiushi 2y ago
        >Similarly some people like you like to thinker and find out how to get Linux to work in 1999 while most prefer to just pay to use Windows NT/MacOS and get to work. We're not talking about regular people here. Try reading the prior messages for context before commenting. We're talking about people who claim to be IT professionals. If they were really as smart as they claimed, they could have done the same thing I did easily. They didn't, not because they loved Windows that much (maybe they did, maybe they didn't, it's irrelevant), but because it was seen as essential for their career.
      - krzyk 2y ago
        > You think if Linux was that usable at everything in 1999 companies and individuals wouldn't have loves to use that instead of paying thousand of dollars to Microsoft? Inertia is a strong force in corporations. I wouldn't count on reason there, inertia triumphs it. Personal anecdotes is something that shows it can be done. In few corps I worked since 2004 I was also able to switch windows to linux (as many other developers there) and we didn't loose functionality. But I get it that for people that work mostly in excel it would be a blocker, as it doesn't have Linux version - so not all work could be done on Linux. But having options is good. My current corp decided to give people a choice (after a decade of asking for it) and since 2 years we can choose between Windows, macOS and Linux. (I'm still amazed that most developers chose macOS, as it is less power user friendly than Windows). Before I was the only one with Linux, now there are > 20% of us. And possibly more in the future when hardware will be upgaded.
- notepad0x90 2y ago
  I'm sorry to say that while Linux is viable for highly skilled people, managing it as you would an AD joined windows workstation or server is not as easy. finding people to run Linux is also much harder.
  - shiroiushi 2y ago
    Again, this is a decision by the managers and corporations, which is my whole point. They could have chosen to use Linux despite these difficulties. You can argue all you want about how much easier Windows was to administer, but ultimately it was a choice by the corporate managers to use it. Linux had its own advantages (cost, not having to worry about all the MS viruses of the 2000s, etc.) too.
    - notepad0x90 2y ago
      If you can't afford something, for you it does not exist. Linux does not exist for those managers and corporations for the specific use cases we're talking about. If you simply can't even get an applicant for a linux admin job in your hiring pipeline, what is the point of even pretending linux exists?
      - shiroiushi 2y ago
        You still haven't invalidated my point. The managers chose Windows, instead of choosing something else, like Linux, Mac, Sun, SGI, Cray, etc., for various reasons (possibly including cost, availability of qualified employees, etc.). They did not choose Windows because a bunch of devs from India were too poor to buy Macs, which was the original assertion.
        notepad0x90 2y ago
        I don't agree with the original assertion either. Yes, it was for various reasons, my point was it is not their responsibility to choose non-windows but rather the responsibility of Linux, mac ,sun,etc.. to make their product acceptable to the market.

shiroiushi 2y ago

>Windows worldwide dominance also be blamed on SW devs from developing nations for being too poor to own Macs. Linux has been a viable alternative for decades now for many tasks. This problem wasn't caused by a lack of money. If you want to blame someone for the dominance of Windows, blame corporations and managers, because they're the ones that have chosen it. SW devs from developing nations have only been doing what they perceived to be in their best economic interest.

Rinzler89 2y ago
>Linux has been a viable alternative for decades now for many tasks. For decades?! Maybe on the servers, but on PCs, hardly. Also, even if that may be the case now, it doesn't change the fact that at your job they'll most likely use Windows not Linux on the workstations. Linux is king on the servers, but PCs everywhere will mostly still be Windows, especially in corporate environments.
- shiroiushi 2y ago
  >For decades?! Maybe on the servers, but on PCs, hardly. While it wasn't as easy as it is today, I've been running Linux on my home desktop since around 1999. It's never been that hard, and it did require more careful hardware selection (no, you can't just grab some random dirt-cheap piece-of-shit "winprinter" and expect it to work with Linux), but it's always been quite doable for anyone who claims to be skilled with computers. We're talking about IT workers here, not grandma. >at your job they'll most likely use Windows not Linux on the workstations This is exactly my point in my prior post.
  - Rinzler89 2y ago
    >I've been running Linux on my home desktop since around 1999 Personal anecdotes are not statistics or cases representative for the average user or business. What others do with their systems and their requirements and apps could be very different than yours. You think if Linux was that usable at everything in 1999 companies and individuals wouldn't have loves to use that instead of paying thousand of dollars to Microsoft? Just because you could set it up and use it in 1999 doesn't mean it was the norm. Some people know how to change their own oil while most don't and don't care to since they prefer to pay someone else to do it as they have other hobbies than learning to tinker with their car. Similarly some people like you like to thinker and find out how to get Linux to work in 1999 while most prefer to just pay to use Windows NT/MacOS and get to work.
    - shiroiushi 2y ago
      >Similarly some people like you like to thinker and find out how to get Linux to work in 1999 while most prefer to just pay to use Windows NT/MacOS and get to work. We're not talking about regular people here. Try reading the prior messages for context before commenting. We're talking about people who claim to be IT professionals. If they were really as smart as they claimed, they could have done the same thing I did easily. They didn't, not because they loved Windows that much (maybe they did, maybe they didn't, it's irrelevant), but because it was seen as essential for their career.
    - krzyk 2y ago
      > You think if Linux was that usable at everything in 1999 companies and individuals wouldn't have loves to use that instead of paying thousand of dollars to Microsoft? Inertia is a strong force in corporations. I wouldn't count on reason there, inertia triumphs it. Personal anecdotes is something that shows it can be done. In few corps I worked since 2004 I was also able to switch windows to linux (as many other developers there) and we didn't loose functionality. But I get it that for people that work mostly in excel it would be a blocker, as it doesn't have Linux version - so not all work could be done on Linux. But having options is good. My current corp decided to give people a choice (after a decade of asking for it) and since 2 years we can choose between Windows, macOS and Linux. (I'm still amazed that most developers chose macOS, as it is less power user friendly than Windows). Before I was the only one with Linux, now there are > 20% of us. And possibly more in the future when hardware will be upgaded.
notepad0x90 2y ago
I'm sorry to say that while Linux is viable for highly skilled people, managing it as you would an AD joined windows workstation or server is not as easy. finding people to run Linux is also much harder.
- shiroiushi 2y ago
  Again, this is a decision by the managers and corporations, which is my whole point. They could have chosen to use Linux despite these difficulties. You can argue all you want about how much easier Windows was to administer, but ultimately it was a choice by the corporate managers to use it. Linux had its own advantages (cost, not having to worry about all the MS viruses of the 2000s, etc.) too.
  - notepad0x90 2y ago
    If you can't afford something, for you it does not exist. Linux does not exist for those managers and corporations for the specific use cases we're talking about. If you simply can't even get an applicant for a linux admin job in your hiring pipeline, what is the point of even pretending linux exists?
    - shiroiushi 2y ago
      You still haven't invalidated my point. The managers chose Windows, instead of choosing something else, like Linux, Mac, Sun, SGI, Cray, etc., for various reasons (possibly including cost, availability of qualified employees, etc.). They did not choose Windows because a bunch of devs from India were too poor to buy Macs, which was the original assertion.
      - notepad0x90 2y ago
        I don't agree with the original assertion either. Yes, it was for various reasons, my point was it is not their responsibility to choose non-windows but rather the responsibility of Linux, mac ,sun,etc.. to make their product acceptable to the market.