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What issues that were important back then are still relevant today? That's a serious question, not a snide remark. I guess tariffs are, but (I think) for diff

What issues that were important back then are still relevant today? That's a serious question, not a snide remark. I guess tariffs are, but (I think) for different reasons. Anything else?

jackcosgrove 2y ago
An insider-outsider dynamic, with educated people in the northeastern cities usually playing the role of insiders regardless of the party system. It's not an issue, but it is an electoral dynamic that affected a lot of issues. This might be at a level of abstraction higher than what you're looking for.
SllX 2y ago
Same things as what Washington and Adams had to deal with: state-building. There were the very contentious issues of the Bank of the United States (the Democratic-Republicans under Jefferson and Madison were originally opposed to a National Bank under prior administrations but essentially accepted it as a necessary evil) and slavery, maintaining the balance of power between States in the Senate, appointing justices, postmasters and military commanders, defending the western frontier from Indians, populating the Ohio River Valley, managing relations with the French, British and Spanish, warring with the British, buying Louisiana from France, resolving border disputes with the British and Spanish in North America, etc. I mean beyond that, most issues were local. Voters only voted directly for their Representatives, local offices and Electors during the Presidential Elections, and who that Elector was mattered a lot more given you know, this is basically almost entirely pre-Industrial Revolution and both long distance traveling and long distance communications was still basically Medieval-tier garbage. You wanted to know that your Representative was getting you a good deal in Office and was a man of good character by whatever standard you judged that to be. EDIT: Almost forgot: checkout American Elections: Wicked Game (a podcast) for the nitty gritty on individual elections. They covered every Presidential election leading up to the 2020 election and they’re currently in the midst of re-releasing it leading up to this year’s election with some updated content.
- mcswell 2y ago
  Your first paragraph is sort of what I expected. I'm not sure how the Bank thing fits today, but slavery is gone, the appointment of postmasters and military commanders is seldom an issue (once you get past a certain obstructionist senator who didn't want anyone appointed), we're no longer defending the western frontier against the Indians, the Ohio valley is maybe de-populating itself (rust belt), relations with the Brits are good and reasonably good with Spain and France, no war with the British, Louisiana has been American for going on two centuries, no more border disputes with the Brits or Spain (nor with Canada or Mexico). I guess appointing justices is still an issue, and certainly the balance of power between the states and the feds is an issue. But most--not all--of the national issues that the US faced back then seem to have gone away or are at least greatly diminished. Thanks for the pointer to that podcast!
  - SllX 2y ago
    One correction I want to make on the point of slavery: slavery as practiced in the antebellum South through the end of the Civil War is gone. Slavery is very much an alive and active albeit illegal in most parts of the world trade, and the global slave trade today is larger than the Trans-Atlantic slave trade was at its peak. The United States is still very active in combatting slavery and the slave trade, usually under the polite euphemism of “human trafficking”. Appointing Justices is far more of an issue now than it ever was back then where it was a rather inglorious business-as-usual position. It had become more important even before then, but it really became an issue in the popular-consciousness after Roe v. Wade and every single confirmation process between Roe and Dobbs was mired in it. We’ve had only one confirmation since then, so I guess it is too soon to say whether how much it will continue to affect the confirmation hearings. I also forgot to mention the Barbary Wars, and I actually just watched a video about it yesterday from The Fat Electrician: https://youtu.be/lcJhmm3D3OY https://youtu.be/lcJhmm3D3OY
_heimdall 2y ago
No one is debating the idea of a standing military today, but we should be now and they did back then. The same goes for a central bank, Hamilton and Jefferson debated this heavily and today we have something very much like what Hamilton wanted. We aren't debating banking but it's hugely important and flies under almost everyone's radar. There's also the (maybe) obvious recent topic of liquor. A recent court ruling overturned bans on home distillation and way back in the Washington presidency they had to send the military to squash a revolt driven by a liquor tax.

What issues that were important back then are still relevant today? That's a serious question, not a snide remark. I guess tariffs are, but (I think) for different reasons. Anything else?

jackcosgrove 2y ago

An insider-outsider dynamic, with educated people in the northeastern cities usually playing the role of insiders regardless of the party system. It's not an issue, but it is an electoral dynamic that affected a lot of issues. This might be at a level of abstraction higher than what you're looking for.

SllX 2y ago

Same things as what Washington and Adams had to deal with: state-building. There were the very contentious issues of the Bank of the United States (the Democratic-Republicans under Jefferson and Madison were originally opposed to a National Bank under prior administrations but essentially accepted it as a necessary evil) and slavery, maintaining the balance of power between States in the Senate, appointing justices, postmasters and military commanders, defending the western frontier from Indians, populating the Ohio River Valley, managing relations with the French, British and Spanish, warring with the British, buying Louisiana from France, resolving border disputes with the British and Spanish in North America, etc. I mean beyond that, most issues were local. Voters only voted directly for their Representatives, local offices and Electors during the Presidential Elections, and who that Elector was mattered a lot more given you know, this is basically almost entirely pre-Industrial Revolution and both long distance traveling and long distance communications was still basically Medieval-tier garbage. You wanted to know that your Representative was getting you a good deal in Office and was a man of good character by whatever standard you judged that to be. EDIT: Almost forgot: checkout American Elections: Wicked Game (a podcast) for the nitty gritty on individual elections. They covered every Presidential election leading up to the 2020 election and they’re currently in the midst of re-releasing it leading up to this year’s election with some updated content.

mcswell 2y ago
Your first paragraph is sort of what I expected. I'm not sure how the Bank thing fits today, but slavery is gone, the appointment of postmasters and military commanders is seldom an issue (once you get past a certain obstructionist senator who didn't want anyone appointed), we're no longer defending the western frontier against the Indians, the Ohio valley is maybe de-populating itself (rust belt), relations with the Brits are good and reasonably good with Spain and France, no war with the British, Louisiana has been American for going on two centuries, no more border disputes with the Brits or Spain (nor with Canada or Mexico). I guess appointing justices is still an issue, and certainly the balance of power between the states and the feds is an issue. But most--not all--of the national issues that the US faced back then seem to have gone away or are at least greatly diminished. Thanks for the pointer to that podcast!
- SllX 2y ago
  One correction I want to make on the point of slavery: slavery as practiced in the antebellum South through the end of the Civil War is gone. Slavery is very much an alive and active albeit illegal in most parts of the world trade, and the global slave trade today is larger than the Trans-Atlantic slave trade was at its peak. The United States is still very active in combatting slavery and the slave trade, usually under the polite euphemism of “human trafficking”. Appointing Justices is far more of an issue now than it ever was back then where it was a rather inglorious business-as-usual position. It had become more important even before then, but it really became an issue in the popular-consciousness after Roe v. Wade and every single confirmation process between Roe and Dobbs was mired in it. We’ve had only one confirmation since then, so I guess it is too soon to say whether how much it will continue to affect the confirmation hearings. I also forgot to mention the Barbary Wars, and I actually just watched a video about it yesterday from The Fat Electrician: https://youtu.be/lcJhmm3D3OY https://youtu.be/lcJhmm3D3OY

_heimdall 2y ago

No one is debating the idea of a standing military today, but we should be now and they did back then. The same goes for a central bank, Hamilton and Jefferson debated this heavily and today we have something very much like what Hamilton wanted. We aren't debating banking but it's hugely important and flies under almost everyone's radar. There's also the (maybe) obvious recent topic of liquor. A recent court ruling overturned bans on home distillation and way back in the Washington presidency they had to send the military to squash a revolt driven by a liquor tax.