3 ms·

Can you name a first world country that gives out 40% of the public sector jobs to veterans or their children?

by xeromal 2y ago

jfax 2y ago
The UK House of Lords has a quota of 92 hereditary peers, descendants of Norman conquerors.
- TulliusCicero 2y ago
  The House of Lords isn't that powerful, but it's still an embarrassment to have this sort of hereditary system.
- robertlagrant 2y ago
  If that's 40%, the public sector's a lot smaller than I thought.
Rinzler89 2y ago
Sure. In Romania, a lot of public sector jobs (the easy, influential or well paying ones) are given out only via nepotism and political connections, usually to descendants and connections of the former communist party high-ups and former members of the military/intelligence services who now own and run lucrative businesses (monopolies for the state) and their kids are usually in charge of the business or in politics cutting the deals to enable them. There's just no explicit quota system like in Bangladesh, but everything is done in the shadows under the table, and the economy and freedom is good enough that people won't bother revolting over it (again), but everyone knows it's happening. I think it's similar all over the Balkans, Former Yugoslav and former USSR countries.
- alephnerd 2y ago
  Not to be that guy but Romania isn't "first world" (yet). It's still very much developing imo.
  - Rinzler89 2y ago
    IIRC, a couple of years ago it passed into the developed nations club.
    - alephnerd 2y ago
      It's HDI is still well below those of other "developed" countries (0.900 and above), and despite the GDP per Capita increase, average household (EDIT: individual, not household) income is still below $6,000/yr [0] so comparable to Mexico, Thailand, and Turkiye (edit: comparable to Mexico and Turkiye, not Thailand which is at $6,000 still) In 10-15 it will become a developed country but right now it isn't. I am a big Romania booster though so I'm not trying to put it down [0] - https://insse.ro/cms/en/content/household-income-and-expenditure-31 https://insse.ro/cms/en/content/household-income-and-expendi...
      - Rinzler89 2y ago
        Fine, how about Ursula v.d. Leyen? It's not a quota system, but politicians in developed EU countries too get groomed and put in high leadership positions due to their family connections. It's more rare here since the wealthy elite tend to fund political candidates to do their bidding and not get involved into politic personally but it's the same kind of buying influence just with extra steps. >average household income is still below $6,000/yr WAHT?! That smells like bullshit. Average NET monthly salary in Romania is around 1000 Euros[1] now meaning roughly 12000/year. Did you check your link you posted? According to that average household income in Romania is 1334 Euros per month or 1600 Euros per year. Where the hell did you get 6000 USD/year? Did you ask a hallucinating LLM and didn't bother to fact check it? Romania is poor but is not that poor. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_European_countries_by_average_wage https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_European_countries_by_...
        alephnerd 2y ago
        Good question! There absolutely is nepotism in the political sphere in every political system - but that's not what students are opposed about alone. Basically, every government job (teacher, doctor, tax collector, bureaucrat, bus driver, etc), government funded service (college, hospital, etc), and PSU (eg. govt owned banks, energy companies, factories) will have a quota in favor of those who are the descendants of martyrs from the 1971 Liberation War. It's the equivalent of party apparatchiks and elite in Ceceascu era Romania who had the pick of the litter for high paying civil service and public sector jobs. This does not happen in developed countries, and in situations where biased hiring is found, you have a slam dunk corruption case. There's a reason Leyen became a party politician and not a nameless civil servant. > Where the hell did you get 6000 USD/year From the Romanian government press release I linked - "The total monthly average income*) was, in nominal terms, 6634 lei per household and 2648 lei per person in quarter IV 2022." Multiply that number by 4 (because it's quarters not month) and that the yearly average income. Edit: Good catch - I misread the data. Average income PER PERSON is around $6,000. Average HOUSEHOLD is around $12,000. I still stand by my assertion though, because Mexico's average household income is around $12,000-15,000. Can't reply to you OP (I think the flame war detector got a false positive) but yea you are right that the numbers I gave were wrong so I've added edit comments. I don't use LLMs btw. I inherently distrust them. I just have these numbers imprinted in my mind because I have no life.
- avrionov 2y ago
  What you described is nepotism, which is not made into a law, but it happens because of a captured state.

Can you name a first world country that gives out 40% of the public sector jobs to veterans or their children?

jfax 2y ago

The UK House of Lords has a quota of 92 hereditary peers, descendants of Norman conquerors.

TulliusCicero 2y ago
The House of Lords isn't that powerful, but it's still an embarrassment to have this sort of hereditary system.
robertlagrant 2y ago
If that's 40%, the public sector's a lot smaller than I thought.

Rinzler89 2y ago

Sure. In Romania, a lot of public sector jobs (the easy, influential or well paying ones) are given out only via nepotism and political connections, usually to descendants and connections of the former communist party high-ups and former members of the military/intelligence services who now own and run lucrative businesses (monopolies for the state) and their kids are usually in charge of the business or in politics cutting the deals to enable them. There's just no explicit quota system like in Bangladesh, but everything is done in the shadows under the table, and the economy and freedom is good enough that people won't bother revolting over it (again), but everyone knows it's happening. I think it's similar all over the Balkans, Former Yugoslav and former USSR countries.

alephnerd 2y ago
Not to be that guy but Romania isn't "first world" (yet). It's still very much developing imo.
- Rinzler89 2y ago
  IIRC, a couple of years ago it passed into the developed nations club.
  - alephnerd 2y ago
    It's HDI is still well below those of other "developed" countries (0.900 and above), and despite the GDP per Capita increase, average household (EDIT: individual, not household) income is still below $6,000/yr [0] so comparable to Mexico, Thailand, and Turkiye (edit: comparable to Mexico and Turkiye, not Thailand which is at $6,000 still) In 10-15 it will become a developed country but right now it isn't. I am a big Romania booster though so I'm not trying to put it down [0] - https://insse.ro/cms/en/content/household-income-and-expenditure-31 https://insse.ro/cms/en/content/household-income-and-expendi...
    - Rinzler89 2y ago
      Fine, how about Ursula v.d. Leyen? It's not a quota system, but politicians in developed EU countries too get groomed and put in high leadership positions due to their family connections. It's more rare here since the wealthy elite tend to fund political candidates to do their bidding and not get involved into politic personally but it's the same kind of buying influence just with extra steps. >average household income is still below $6,000/yr WAHT?! That smells like bullshit. Average NET monthly salary in Romania is around 1000 Euros[1] now meaning roughly 12000/year. Did you check your link you posted? According to that average household income in Romania is 1334 Euros per month or 1600 Euros per year. Where the hell did you get 6000 USD/year? Did you ask a hallucinating LLM and didn't bother to fact check it? Romania is poor but is not that poor. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_European_countries_by_average_wage https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_European_countries_by_...
      - alephnerd 2y ago
        Good question! There absolutely is nepotism in the political sphere in every political system - but that's not what students are opposed about alone. Basically, every government job (teacher, doctor, tax collector, bureaucrat, bus driver, etc), government funded service (college, hospital, etc), and PSU (eg. govt owned banks, energy companies, factories) will have a quota in favor of those who are the descendants of martyrs from the 1971 Liberation War. It's the equivalent of party apparatchiks and elite in Ceceascu era Romania who had the pick of the litter for high paying civil service and public sector jobs. This does not happen in developed countries, and in situations where biased hiring is found, you have a slam dunk corruption case. There's a reason Leyen became a party politician and not a nameless civil servant. > Where the hell did you get 6000 USD/year From the Romanian government press release I linked - "The total monthly average income*) was, in nominal terms, 6634 lei per household and 2648 lei per person in quarter IV 2022." Multiply that number by 4 (because it's quarters not month) and that the yearly average income. Edit: Good catch - I misread the data. Average income PER PERSON is around $6,000. Average HOUSEHOLD is around $12,000. I still stand by my assertion though, because Mexico's average household income is around $12,000-15,000. Can't reply to you OP (I think the flame war detector got a false positive) but yea you are right that the numbers I gave were wrong so I've added edit comments. I don't use LLMs btw. I inherently distrust them. I just have these numbers imprinted in my mind because I have no life.
avrionov 2y ago
What you described is nepotism, which is not made into a law, but it happens because of a captured state.