5 ms·

Against choosing your political allegiances based on who is "pro-crypto"

78 points by bpierre 2y ago

Analemma_ 2y ago
A great article which will go in one ear and out the other of the people who actually follow Vitalik. The other day he tweeted a pretty anodyne statement about how getting vaccinated against covid is good, and was mauled in the replies by his supposed fans. I imagine it's a special circle of hell to be an extremely intelligent person whose hordes of fanatical devotees are all some of the dumbest people alive.
- m3kw9 2y ago
  They are just in it because he is supposed to make ETH go up, they care about TX costs because a lower one will make it go up, more privacy..up. It ain’t because it will convert the world into a better place
cal5k 2y ago
> Another important conclusion of this is that if a politician is pro-crypto today, but they are the type of person that is either very power-seeking themselves, or willing to suck up to someone who is, then this is the direction that their crypto advocacy may look like ten years from now. Vitalik strikes me as being very naive about the process of policy-making. All politicians are, by definition, power-seeking individuals. They're seeking the power afforded to them by a seat on city council, as governor, a member of congress, etc. This is simply the nature of the political process. They may even be seeking power in pursuit of a noble objective, but they are seeking power nonetheless. Realpolitik as a non-politician means aligning yourself with whoever best represents your interests at that particular point in time. One election cycle that may be Party A, but in the future it could be Party B. It could differ at the federal, state, or local level. Frequent elections and term limits ensure that turnover will happen, so change will be the only constant. Flexibility is required. Waiting for the perfectly ideologically-aligned candidate sounds nice, but in reality it means you'll be waiting forever. All politicians are flawed, and many will simply tell you what they think you want to hear. Their behaviour is amenable to incentives, however, which is why donations are such an important - if maligned - mechanism for accountability. Marc & Ben are being practical. They've observed that the behaviour of one party has run directly counter to their interests over the last several years and they're aligning themselves with the party that is at least proposing a better set of policies. That's just... how this stuff works and has always worked.
- demondemidi 2y ago
  You made up your own definition of politician to prove your point. Thats fallacious reasoning. I was in politics for four years not for power but to help people organize and prevent corporate takeover of family farms. Get bent, dude.
  - mplewis9z 2y ago
    > They may even be seeking power in pursuit of a noble objective, but they are seeking power nonetheless. Think you might meet this definition, my guy.
  - lifty 2y ago
    You were endowed with power in order to pursue a noble goal. But it was the power you sought that allowed you to do that. I think he’s definition is correct.
  - octopoc 2y ago
    Thank you for your service. I think it’s popular to be dismissive and say that all politicians are sociopaths, which sounds very similar to saying they’re all power seeking individuals. The reason they sound similar is because there’s this idea that seeking power is always bad, but your example proves otherwise. So again, thank you!
- mcguire 2y ago
  "...counter to their interests..." Very important words, there.
- comfysocks 2y ago
  I agree that you sometimes have to pick you battles and have allegiances of convenience. However, my opinion is that an excessive amount of “selling your soul to the devil” for short term gains is the root cause of much of what is wrong in business and politics.
- cocacola1 2y ago
  It's endlessly interesting to read how people narrow broad points.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
pimpampum 2y ago
Vitalik is pretty based.
verdverm 2y ago
I have (had?) a good friend who is in this group Vitalik is talking about. They've actually lived with Vitalik and co-authored posts with him. Cyrpto-culture changed him in ways I find troubling and I hope this might bring them back closer to the person they were prior to crypto corrupting their values.
Animats 2y ago
The politicians who are pro-crypto were paid to be so.[1] Well-paid.[2] [1] https://www.ft.com/content/63ad2147-0aa7-4e28-9cf5-6ce3ce7a2b0c https://www.ft.com/content/63ad2147-0aa7-4e28-9cf5-6ce3ce7a2... [2] https://www.opensecrets.org/news/2024/05/congress-blocked-sec-guidance-on-crypto-as-industry-lobbying-surged https://www.opensecrets.org/news/2024/05/congress-blocked-se...
- beaglesss 2y ago
  That just tells me crypto proponents aren't completely stupid. You must pay if you want a seat in this 'democratic' process.
- Gazoche 2y ago
  Just plugging in Molly White's great investigative work: https://www.followthecrypto.org/ https://www.followthecrypto.org/
  - Animats 2y ago
    "Cyptocurrency-focused political action committees have raised more than $187 million to influence 2024 elections. They have spent more than $39 million of it so far." That's so crypto community. Where did the rest of the money go?
cooolbear 2y ago
So their politics on freedom and privacy of blah blah blah non-cohesive ideology doesn't correlate with their actual stance on crypto. A politician being pro-crypto does, however, tell me that they are dumb enough to be duped/greedy enough to be paid into wasting time giving lip service to something that, regardless of ideology, is actually completely worthless.
- antifa 2y ago
  Not just completely worthless, but net negative value on society.
cyanydeez 2y ago
Also keep in mind, wanting to crash america, democracy and fiat currency are 'pro crypto' motivatrd positions.

78 points by bpierre 2y ago

A great article which will go in one ear and out the other of the people who actually follow Vitalik. The other day he tweeted a pretty anodyne statement about how getting vaccinated against covid is good, and was mauled in the replies by his supposed fans. I imagine it's a special circle of hell to be an extremely intelligent person whose hordes of fanatical devotees are all some of the dumbest people alive.

m3kw9 2y ago
They are just in it because he is supposed to make ETH go up, they care about TX costs because a lower one will make it go up, more privacy..up. It ain’t because it will convert the world into a better place

cal5k 2y ago

> Another important conclusion of this is that if a politician is pro-crypto today, but they are the type of person that is either very power-seeking themselves, or willing to suck up to someone who is, then this is the direction that their crypto advocacy may look like ten years from now. Vitalik strikes me as being very naive about the process of policy-making. All politicians are, by definition, power-seeking individuals. They're seeking the power afforded to them by a seat on city council, as governor, a member of congress, etc. This is simply the nature of the political process. They may even be seeking power in pursuit of a noble objective, but they are seeking power nonetheless. Realpolitik as a non-politician means aligning yourself with whoever best represents your interests at that particular point in time. One election cycle that may be Party A, but in the future it could be Party B. It could differ at the federal, state, or local level. Frequent elections and term limits ensure that turnover will happen, so change will be the only constant. Flexibility is required. Waiting for the perfectly ideologically-aligned candidate sounds nice, but in reality it means you'll be waiting forever. All politicians are flawed, and many will simply tell you what they think you want to hear. Their behaviour is amenable to incentives, however, which is why donations are such an important - if maligned - mechanism for accountability. Marc & Ben are being practical. They've observed that the behaviour of one party has run directly counter to their interests over the last several years and they're aligning themselves with the party that is at least proposing a better set of policies. That's just... how this stuff works and has always worked.

demondemidi 2y ago
You made up your own definition of politician to prove your point. Thats fallacious reasoning. I was in politics for four years not for power but to help people organize and prevent corporate takeover of family farms. Get bent, dude.
- mplewis9z 2y ago
  > They may even be seeking power in pursuit of a noble objective, but they are seeking power nonetheless. Think you might meet this definition, my guy.
- lifty 2y ago
  You were endowed with power in order to pursue a noble goal. But it was the power you sought that allowed you to do that. I think he’s definition is correct.
- octopoc 2y ago
  Thank you for your service. I think it’s popular to be dismissive and say that all politicians are sociopaths, which sounds very similar to saying they’re all power seeking individuals. The reason they sound similar is because there’s this idea that seeking power is always bad, but your example proves otherwise. So again, thank you!
mcguire 2y ago
"...counter to their interests..." Very important words, there.
comfysocks 2y ago
I agree that you sometimes have to pick you battles and have allegiances of convenience. However, my opinion is that an excessive amount of “selling your soul to the devil” for short term gains is the root cause of much of what is wrong in business and politics.
cocacola1 2y ago
It's endlessly interesting to read how people narrow broad points.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

pimpampum 2y ago

Vitalik is pretty based.

verdverm 2y ago

I have (had?) a good friend who is in this group Vitalik is talking about. They've actually lived with Vitalik and co-authored posts with him. Cyrpto-culture changed him in ways I find troubling and I hope this might bring them back closer to the person they were prior to crypto corrupting their values.

Animats 2y ago

The politicians who are pro-crypto were paid to be so.[1] Well-paid.[2] [1] https://www.ft.com/content/63ad2147-0aa7-4e28-9cf5-6ce3ce7a2b0c https://www.ft.com/content/63ad2147-0aa7-4e28-9cf5-6ce3ce7a2... [2] https://www.opensecrets.org/news/2024/05/congress-blocked-sec-guidance-on-crypto-as-industry-lobbying-surged https://www.opensecrets.org/news/2024/05/congress-blocked-se...

beaglesss 2y ago
That just tells me crypto proponents aren't completely stupid. You must pay if you want a seat in this 'democratic' process.
Gazoche 2y ago
Just plugging in Molly White's great investigative work: https://www.followthecrypto.org/ https://www.followthecrypto.org/
- Animats 2y ago
  "Cyptocurrency-focused political action committees have raised more than $187 million to influence 2024 elections. They have spent more than $39 million of it so far." That's so crypto community. Where did the rest of the money go?

cooolbear 2y ago

So their politics on freedom and privacy of blah blah blah non-cohesive ideology doesn't correlate with their actual stance on crypto. A politician being pro-crypto does, however, tell me that they are dumb enough to be duped/greedy enough to be paid into wasting time giving lip service to something that, regardless of ideology, is actually completely worthless.

antifa 2y ago
Not just completely worthless, but net negative value on society.

cyanydeez 2y ago

Also keep in mind, wanting to crash america, democracy and fiat currency are 'pro crypto' motivatrd positions.