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Facebook’s Camera app gets a new name: Camera•. Yes, “•”

61 points by nextstep 14y ago

Karunamon 14y ago
So what's the right way to pronounce this app? Camera dot? Camera period? Does that symbol have a funny name?
- wxl 14y ago
  Camera Bullet, I think.
  - thwarted 14y ago
    "point and shoot"?
    - idleloops 14y ago
      A far better name. I hope Facebook use this - and fill your pockets with gold.
      - thwarted 14y ago
        I was mainly focused on "shoot" being related to "bullet".
- roryokane 14y ago
  That symbol is a “bullet”: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bullet_%28typography%29 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bullet_%28typography%29. But I would just pronounce the name “camera dot”.
- notatoad 14y ago
  i think you're just supposed to pretend the dot isn't there, probably.
- jen_h 14y ago
  This has been driving me crazy a little. Is it Camera Dot? Camera Interpunct? Camera Bullet? Camera Middle Dot? Camera Diacritical Character? But I think, maybe, just "Facebook Camera" is the name they'd choose. Glad they changed the name, though...am assuming Apple made them change it (which makes "interpunct" kind of hilarious); was totally surprised that it made it through to begin with--an identical icon with a different background color & the same name, many users wouldn't know the difference...and "Camera Interpunct? Dot?" is way better than "Camera - I don't know what happened, but my camera is broken and it always goes to Facebook!"
  - idleloops 14y ago
    Name spacing isn't that hard. Facebook should be able to call it Camera - and to differentiate it from another Camera app, call it Facebook Camera. Trying to trademark dictionary words is just silly.
  - acheron 14y ago
    I don't think the bullet is a diacritical mark for anything, though I could be wrong.
- jdale27 14y ago
  Let Victor Borge explain: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bpIbdZhrzA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bpIbdZhrzA
  - drostie 14y ago
    Reminds me also of "Real Men Don't Play GURPS": Mark Rein·Hagen, the designer of Storyteller, was once asked, "How do you pronounce the dot in your name?" He replied, "It's unpronounceable, and symbolises how meaningless are the labels that we attach to ourselves." One can tell immediately from this comment that Mark Rein·Hagen is a Quiche Eater. Real Men don't need the abstract concepts introduced by Quiche-Eating games--like characterisation, immersiveness or realism--to get their jobs done. They are perfectly happy with a sword, a spellbook, and a beer. http://home.zipworld.com.au/~hong/dnd/realmen.htm http://home.zipworld.com.au/~hong/dnd/realmen.htm
AznHisoka 14y ago
It's for app store optimization. They want to rank high for camera
ceol 14y ago
It certainly doesn't make any sense from a consistency standpoint, but then again, Facebook is one of the least consistent web apps I've used. Everything from their developer SDKs/APIs to their end user mobile apps are ever-changing and often times filled with bugs or "What were they thinking?!" behavior. In terms of splitting functionality into separate iOS apps, I don't trust they'll be able to keep the UX consistent, either.
kolinko 14y ago
I bet this is because of the App Store SEO. The way search works is that if a user types in "Camera" in the search field, the first apps that come up on top are the ones that are called simply "Camera[+non-letter-chars]". Even if Facebook's Camera had a gazillion downloads, it would end up below apps called "Camera+++", just because of the name. By changing the name from "Facebook Camera" to "Camera•" the company is guaranteed to position on top of the search for the phrase "Camera", and get even more downloads. And once they changed it to "Camera•" in the App Store it only made sense to change the name to "Camera•" on the device, to maintain consistency in the naming. (disclaimer: I'm the founder of AppCod.es, and we've analysed the details of Apple's search engine in detail :) )
- Geee 14y ago
  That's quite interesting. Are there particular sorting rules for those non-letter characters? Why is + before •?
  - esrauch 14y ago
    Each character has a numerical value that is fairly standardized as ASCII or Unicode. Typically + maps to 43, a to 97 (b to 98, c to 99, ...) and • to 149 and will be sorted in that order. That's a bit of a simplification; often times more sophisticated orderings are used, especially with consideration to internationalization.
    - deleted 14y ago
      [deleted]
    - wahnfrieden 14y ago
      Yes but apple doesn't use that. See kolinko's comment.
    - sk5t 14y ago
      For more information, the appropriate search term is "collation" -- ordering words and terms according to the rules of an alphabet, case sensitivity, accent sensitivity...
stock_toaster 14y ago
I bet camera+ just /loves/ this. note: sarcasm applied.
- dutchbrit 14y ago
  Indeed, swapping + with • is a tad dirty, even if "camera" is the best way to describe it.
  - idleloops 14y ago
    Yes, dirty is the appropriate word here. It has a rather unsavoury feeling about it.
PoppyPlant 14y ago
I'm tired of nicheification and SEO. The internet is turning into a playground for investment bankers seeking to cut us all into marketable stereotypes. Corporations, jostling for control over basic language and its use. The fact that this "App" is going to be put into a "marketplace" that is guided by corporate concern bothers me too.
uvTwitch 14y ago
Absurd. Why not "Camera!", or something that can actually be pronounced, and that, you know, makes -sense-?
- andyking 14y ago
  That's even worse! How are you meant to say that without sounding fake-excited? There's a radio station around here called "PULSE!" that I have the same issue with. It's not even an exciting radio station.
  - sjwright 14y ago
    Yahoo!
jaredsohn 14y ago
Here's what I get when doing a search for "camera" from the iPhone AppStore: Camera+, Camera ∞, Socialcam Video Camera, Camera!!, Camera, Camera ®, "Camera,", Camera.., CamWow: Free photo ..., Camera-, Instagram, CamWow Retro, 8mm Vintage Camera, Facebook Camera, ... Notice how far down Facebook Camera is currently on this list. Edit: I realize that the screenshot on the website shows the search order among installed apps, but I think this may be relevant, too.
alexkcd 14y ago
My guess is that Apple asked Facebook not to use the same name as the built in camera, and Facebook complied to avoid damaging their renewed relationship.
vibrunazo 14y ago
A few years ago, MySpace decided to get creative and re-branded to "My_". [1] And we all know what happened to My_. [1] http://techcrunch.com/2010/10/08/new-myspace-logo/ http://techcrunch.com/2010/10/08/new-myspace-logo/
- dutchbrit 14y ago
  MySpace was already dead by then however.
  - idleloops 14y ago
    I doubt you can call MySpace dead.
k-mcgrady 14y ago
It is not an App Store SEO trick. They only changed the name the app shows on the device. On the App Store it's still called Facebook Camera. My guess is that Apple has asked them to change it as 'Camera' is what they call their camera app.
glimcat 14y ago
If you're going to allow dozens of Camera* names, why the heck don't you just allow them all to be called Camera and let people sort them out by publisher? It's not like you should be using the name as the GUID anyway, or like Camera is a reasonably defensible trademark for a camera program.

61 points by nextstep 14y ago

Karunamon 14y ago

So what's the right way to pronounce this app? Camera dot? Camera period? Does that symbol have a funny name?

wxl 14y ago
Camera Bullet, I think.
- thwarted 14y ago
  "point and shoot"?
  - idleloops 14y ago
    A far better name. I hope Facebook use this - and fill your pockets with gold.
    - thwarted 14y ago
      I was mainly focused on "shoot" being related to "bullet".
roryokane 14y ago
That symbol is a “bullet”: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bullet_%28typography%29 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bullet_%28typography%29. But I would just pronounce the name “camera dot”.
notatoad 14y ago
i think you're just supposed to pretend the dot isn't there, probably.
jen_h 14y ago
This has been driving me crazy a little. Is it Camera Dot? Camera Interpunct? Camera Bullet? Camera Middle Dot? Camera Diacritical Character? But I think, maybe, just "Facebook Camera" is the name they'd choose. Glad they changed the name, though...am assuming Apple made them change it (which makes "interpunct" kind of hilarious); was totally surprised that it made it through to begin with--an identical icon with a different background color & the same name, many users wouldn't know the difference...and "Camera Interpunct? Dot?" is way better than "Camera - I don't know what happened, but my camera is broken and it always goes to Facebook!"
- idleloops 14y ago
  Name spacing isn't that hard. Facebook should be able to call it Camera - and to differentiate it from another Camera app, call it Facebook Camera. Trying to trademark dictionary words is just silly.
- acheron 14y ago
  I don't think the bullet is a diacritical mark for anything, though I could be wrong.
jdale27 14y ago
Let Victor Borge explain: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bpIbdZhrzA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bpIbdZhrzA
- drostie 14y ago
  Reminds me also of "Real Men Don't Play GURPS": Mark Rein·Hagen, the designer of Storyteller, was once asked, "How do you pronounce the dot in your name?" He replied, "It's unpronounceable, and symbolises how meaningless are the labels that we attach to ourselves." One can tell immediately from this comment that Mark Rein·Hagen is a Quiche Eater. Real Men don't need the abstract concepts introduced by Quiche-Eating games--like characterisation, immersiveness or realism--to get their jobs done. They are perfectly happy with a sword, a spellbook, and a beer. http://home.zipworld.com.au/~hong/dnd/realmen.htm http://home.zipworld.com.au/~hong/dnd/realmen.htm

AznHisoka 14y ago

It's for app store optimization. They want to rank high for camera

ceol 14y ago

It certainly doesn't make any sense from a consistency standpoint, but then again, Facebook is one of the least consistent web apps I've used. Everything from their developer SDKs/APIs to their end user mobile apps are ever-changing and often times filled with bugs or "What were they thinking?!" behavior. In terms of splitting functionality into separate iOS apps, I don't trust they'll be able to keep the UX consistent, either.

kolinko 14y ago

I bet this is because of the App Store SEO. The way search works is that if a user types in "Camera" in the search field, the first apps that come up on top are the ones that are called simply "Camera[+non-letter-chars]". Even if Facebook's Camera had a gazillion downloads, it would end up below apps called "Camera+++", just because of the name. By changing the name from "Facebook Camera" to "Camera•" the company is guaranteed to position on top of the search for the phrase "Camera", and get even more downloads. And once they changed it to "Camera•" in the App Store it only made sense to change the name to "Camera•" on the device, to maintain consistency in the naming. (disclaimer: I'm the founder of AppCod.es, and we've analysed the details of Apple's search engine in detail :) )

Geee 14y ago
That's quite interesting. Are there particular sorting rules for those non-letter characters? Why is + before •?
- esrauch 14y ago
  Each character has a numerical value that is fairly standardized as ASCII or Unicode. Typically + maps to 43, a to 97 (b to 98, c to 99, ...) and • to 149 and will be sorted in that order. That's a bit of a simplification; often times more sophisticated orderings are used, especially with consideration to internationalization.
  - deleted 14y ago
    [deleted]
  - wahnfrieden 14y ago
    Yes but apple doesn't use that. See kolinko's comment.
  - sk5t 14y ago
    For more information, the appropriate search term is "collation" -- ordering words and terms according to the rules of an alphabet, case sensitivity, accent sensitivity...

stock_toaster 14y ago

I bet camera+ just /loves/ this. note: sarcasm applied.

dutchbrit 14y ago
Indeed, swapping + with • is a tad dirty, even if "camera" is the best way to describe it.
- idleloops 14y ago
  Yes, dirty is the appropriate word here. It has a rather unsavoury feeling about it.

PoppyPlant 14y ago

I'm tired of nicheification and SEO. The internet is turning into a playground for investment bankers seeking to cut us all into marketable stereotypes. Corporations, jostling for control over basic language and its use. The fact that this "App" is going to be put into a "marketplace" that is guided by corporate concern bothers me too.

uvTwitch 14y ago

Absurd. Why not "Camera!", or something that can actually be pronounced, and that, you know, makes -sense-?

andyking 14y ago
That's even worse! How are you meant to say that without sounding fake-excited? There's a radio station around here called "PULSE!" that I have the same issue with. It's not even an exciting radio station.
- sjwright 14y ago
  Yahoo!

jaredsohn 14y ago

Here's what I get when doing a search for "camera" from the iPhone AppStore: Camera+, Camera ∞, Socialcam Video Camera, Camera!!, Camera, Camera ®, "Camera,", Camera.., CamWow: Free photo ..., Camera-, Instagram, CamWow Retro, 8mm Vintage Camera, Facebook Camera, ... Notice how far down Facebook Camera is currently on this list. Edit: I realize that the screenshot on the website shows the search order among installed apps, but I think this may be relevant, too.

alexkcd 14y ago

My guess is that Apple asked Facebook not to use the same name as the built in camera, and Facebook complied to avoid damaging their renewed relationship.

vibrunazo 14y ago

A few years ago, MySpace decided to get creative and re-branded to "My_". [1] And we all know what happened to My_. [1] http://techcrunch.com/2010/10/08/new-myspace-logo/ http://techcrunch.com/2010/10/08/new-myspace-logo/

dutchbrit 14y ago
MySpace was already dead by then however.
- idleloops 14y ago
  I doubt you can call MySpace dead.

k-mcgrady 14y ago

It is not an App Store SEO trick. They only changed the name the app shows on the device. On the App Store it's still called Facebook Camera. My guess is that Apple has asked them to change it as 'Camera' is what they call their camera app.

glimcat 14y ago

If you're going to allow dozens of Camera* names, why the heck don't you just allow them all to be called Camera and let people sort them out by publisher? It's not like you should be using the name as the GUID anyway, or like Camera is a reasonably defensible trademark for a camera program.