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So where can I donate to Ladybird browser development? Before anyone tries to respond with it. It is https://donorbox.org/ladybird https://donorbox.org/ladybir

So where can I donate to Ladybird browser development? Before anyone tries to respond with it. It is https://donorbox.org/ladybird https://donorbox.org/ladybird

prox 2y ago
They really need to start adding windows as a build target at some near point in the future. As a webdev, that’s the only way I can convince the public to switch.
- DaoVeles 2y ago
  I mean for a long while even the GNU project provided Windows builds for Icecat browser. Probably to much Stallman grumbling. EDIT : Actually they still update it. Last version is 115.
  - actionfromafar 2y ago
    First time I hear about Icecat browser. It seems like something that should be much more known!
    - DaoVeles 2y ago
      Because of the whole culture of GNU/FSF/Stallman, it can be a little funky at times. It has been a while but I think it still comes bundled with LibreJS, an addon that checks every Java script for Libre licensing. And yes it can be disabled. I get it and I like the idea but it does make for a difficult up front experience.
- lukan 2y ago
  "that’s the only way I can convince the public to switch." It is not ready, to be a public browser.
- master-lincoln 2y ago
  Maybe Ladybird can be a good reason to convince the "public" to switch away from Windows in the near future
  - prox 2y ago
    That would be a great day. Unfortunately the culture of Linux is still too much walled garden, not in the Apple-like commercial sense, but in the tech culture kind of way. We need a way to embrace the public without losing what makes Linux great (to hack it to your own specifications)
- leshenka 2y ago
  It's already too hard to convince public to switch from chrome to another chromium browser or firefox and you're talking about switching to browser that is at least several years away from feature parity
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
- Sammi 2y ago
  They want to be able to run more websites well before they invite the unwashed masses from windows XD
  - prox 2y ago
    I don’t disagree :)
- nektro 2y ago
  it would be very silly for them to add windows support
Ygg2 2y ago
Why Ladybird? Why not Servo?
- different_base 2y ago
  I appreciate Ladybird's initiative. But if they work with Servo, Ladybird can build the browser and Servo can focus on the engine. Also we can avoid C++ nightmare. Everybody wins.
  - suby 2y ago
    Ladybird seems to have more momentum and be further along in development in my testing of visiting random websites. This may or may not have something to do with developer velocity of each language, genuinely I don't know but I think it's worth considering. Regardless, from what I've gathered, Ladybird is going to ship of theseus their way into memory safety. It's not announced what the C++ replacement language will be, but they are working towards that.
  - paddim8 2y ago
    Ladybird is all about the engine. It's progressing faster than servo
    - Ygg2 2y ago
      In what way? Rendering pages CSS compatibility? I tried servo on Windows and it worked, not so much for Ladybird - granted, I wasn't feeling up to task of compiling it for Windows.
      - paddim8 2y ago
        Ladybird doesn't support Windows yet because most developers use Linux or macOS. Ladybird has been progressing faster when it comes to CSS rendering and JavaScript support.
  - sgt 2y ago
    For the user, C++ won't be a nightmare.
tgv 2y ago
Don't hold your breath. It takes ages to develop a browser that's as fast as Firefox. CSS and JS are no joke.
- switch007 2y ago
  Slow is the price we'll have to pay. Just like how VPNs slow down your connection Or, if one dreams for a moment, if slower becomes the norm, web apps will have to become less complicated. Fast seems to just enable more and more ad tech
- quaintdev 2y ago
  Maybe it's time to move away from whole html/css/js, http and browsers? Let's build something that is Ad resistant from the start. Something that uses native technologies. Edit: We need something that does not need backing of large corporations or huge funding to access the web. Internet was always simple. We have become over dependent on browsers and http stack.
  - leshenka 2y ago
    have you got any suggestions?
    - jay_kyburz 2y ago
      HTML only (with forms). Client side css only. No JavaScript. No cookies.
      - tgv 2y ago
        That's not acceptable for 99.9% of the people, so they'll stay on their current browsers. An alternative must be attractive to succeed.
        jay_kyburz 2y ago
        I don't feel the need to fix the whole world. Just my corner of it. I would use it to read my rss feeds. I'm sure we could make Hacker News discussions work. My mastodon feed could probably work too. That's 90% of my browser usage right there. Just imagine how pleasant it would be to browse and navigate. Would be so fast, so responsive. I really like https://geminiprotocol.net/ https://geminiprotocol.net/ but I think they went too far removing images, sounds, video, and forms.
ethagnawl 2y ago
Thanks. I just donated to Ladybird and Servo. Here's the Servo link: https://servo.org/sponsorship/ https://servo.org/sponsorship/
- remram 2y ago
  Is there any reason to believe that the Servo project will produce a full independent browser, rather than a browser engine as their website states? The only likely outcome is that it be used in Firefox...
  - DaoVeles 2y ago
    That would be wild to see. Mozilla drops servo to save costs, only to then later pick it up.
bachmeier 2y ago
How would that solve the problem? Years down the road, if they actually finish their browser, what guarantee do you have against it being enshittified in some way? The only option I see is a project that exists to deshittify an open source browser.
- DaoVeles 2y ago
  So far the core idea is a sort of constitutional foundation to try and ensure it doesn't get absorbed into that think. Mind you, that was Mozilla 20 years ago. Short term, deshittify Firefox. Mid term move to some like Lady bird. Long term, if Lady bird is corrupted, start on browser replacement number 2. Alternatively, the hardest step of just walking away for heavy internet usage I guess.

So where can I donate to Ladybird browser development? Before anyone tries to respond with it. It is https://donorbox.org/ladybird https://donorbox.org/ladybird

prox 2y ago

They really need to start adding windows as a build target at some near point in the future. As a webdev, that’s the only way I can convince the public to switch.

DaoVeles 2y ago
I mean for a long while even the GNU project provided Windows builds for Icecat browser. Probably to much Stallman grumbling. EDIT : Actually they still update it. Last version is 115.
- actionfromafar 2y ago
  First time I hear about Icecat browser. It seems like something that should be much more known!
  - DaoVeles 2y ago
    Because of the whole culture of GNU/FSF/Stallman, it can be a little funky at times. It has been a while but I think it still comes bundled with LibreJS, an addon that checks every Java script for Libre licensing. And yes it can be disabled. I get it and I like the idea but it does make for a difficult up front experience.
lukan 2y ago
"that’s the only way I can convince the public to switch." It is not ready, to be a public browser.
master-lincoln 2y ago
Maybe Ladybird can be a good reason to convince the "public" to switch away from Windows in the near future
- prox 2y ago
  That would be a great day. Unfortunately the culture of Linux is still too much walled garden, not in the Apple-like commercial sense, but in the tech culture kind of way. We need a way to embrace the public without losing what makes Linux great (to hack it to your own specifications)
leshenka 2y ago
It's already too hard to convince public to switch from chrome to another chromium browser or firefox and you're talking about switching to browser that is at least several years away from feature parity
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
Sammi 2y ago
They want to be able to run more websites well before they invite the unwashed masses from windows XD
- prox 2y ago
  I don’t disagree :)
nektro 2y ago
it would be very silly for them to add windows support

Ygg2 2y ago

Why Ladybird? Why not Servo?

different_base 2y ago
I appreciate Ladybird's initiative. But if they work with Servo, Ladybird can build the browser and Servo can focus on the engine. Also we can avoid C++ nightmare. Everybody wins.
- suby 2y ago
  Ladybird seems to have more momentum and be further along in development in my testing of visiting random websites. This may or may not have something to do with developer velocity of each language, genuinely I don't know but I think it's worth considering. Regardless, from what I've gathered, Ladybird is going to ship of theseus their way into memory safety. It's not announced what the C++ replacement language will be, but they are working towards that.
- paddim8 2y ago
  Ladybird is all about the engine. It's progressing faster than servo
  - Ygg2 2y ago
    In what way? Rendering pages CSS compatibility? I tried servo on Windows and it worked, not so much for Ladybird - granted, I wasn't feeling up to task of compiling it for Windows.
    - paddim8 2y ago
      Ladybird doesn't support Windows yet because most developers use Linux or macOS. Ladybird has been progressing faster when it comes to CSS rendering and JavaScript support.
- sgt 2y ago
  For the user, C++ won't be a nightmare.

tgv 2y ago

Don't hold your breath. It takes ages to develop a browser that's as fast as Firefox. CSS and JS are no joke.

switch007 2y ago
Slow is the price we'll have to pay. Just like how VPNs slow down your connection Or, if one dreams for a moment, if slower becomes the norm, web apps will have to become less complicated. Fast seems to just enable more and more ad tech
quaintdev 2y ago
Maybe it's time to move away from whole html/css/js, http and browsers? Let's build something that is Ad resistant from the start. Something that uses native technologies. Edit: We need something that does not need backing of large corporations or huge funding to access the web. Internet was always simple. We have become over dependent on browsers and http stack.
- leshenka 2y ago
  have you got any suggestions?
  - jay_kyburz 2y ago
    HTML only (with forms). Client side css only. No JavaScript. No cookies.
    - tgv 2y ago
      That's not acceptable for 99.9% of the people, so they'll stay on their current browsers. An alternative must be attractive to succeed.
      - jay_kyburz 2y ago
        I don't feel the need to fix the whole world. Just my corner of it. I would use it to read my rss feeds. I'm sure we could make Hacker News discussions work. My mastodon feed could probably work too. That's 90% of my browser usage right there. Just imagine how pleasant it would be to browse and navigate. Would be so fast, so responsive. I really like https://geminiprotocol.net/ https://geminiprotocol.net/ but I think they went too far removing images, sounds, video, and forms.

ethagnawl 2y ago

Thanks. I just donated to Ladybird and Servo. Here's the Servo link: https://servo.org/sponsorship/ https://servo.org/sponsorship/

remram 2y ago
Is there any reason to believe that the Servo project will produce a full independent browser, rather than a browser engine as their website states? The only likely outcome is that it be used in Firefox...
- DaoVeles 2y ago
  That would be wild to see. Mozilla drops servo to save costs, only to then later pick it up.

bachmeier 2y ago

How would that solve the problem? Years down the road, if they actually finish their browser, what guarantee do you have against it being enshittified in some way? The only option I see is a project that exists to deshittify an open source browser.

DaoVeles 2y ago
So far the core idea is a sort of constitutional foundation to try and ensure it doesn't get absorbed into that think. Mind you, that was Mozilla 20 years ago. Short term, deshittify Firefox. Mid term move to some like Lady bird. Long term, if Lady bird is corrupted, start on browser replacement number 2. Alternatively, the hardest step of just walking away for heavy internet usage I guess.