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Aside from the influence of money on politics almost all of what you have written is complete bollocks. Many of us have been successful from nothing and know f

by throwaway22032 2y ago

Aside from the influence of money on politics almost all of what you have written is complete bollocks. Many of us have been successful from nothing and know friends who have been more so. There is usually a luck element in the size of that success but it is blindingly obvious to someone who was in the crab bucket to see that actions work. It sounds as if you have an emotional issue with the idea that people can change their own situation. I literally have a choice tomorrow whether I paint my wall, study, fix up the leak in my loft, etc, or just sit and play my Switch. People who do too much of the latter do not succeed. And no, parents or grandparents or country or genetics or whatever are not luck either. Choosing a suitable mate is about as close to the meaning of life as we have.

toomuchtodo 2y ago
> It sounds as if you have an emotional issue with the idea that people can change their own situation. On the contrary, I am simply data informed. It sounds like you're operating from a mental model that overweighs ability in outcomes. I have provided links below to help you improve and evolve this model. https://www.scientificamerican.com/blog/beautiful-minds/the-role-of-luck-in-life-success-is-far-greater-than-we-realized/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/blog/beautiful-minds/the-... ("The Role of Luck in Life Success Is Far Greater Than We Realized") https://www.technologyreview.com/2018/03/01/144958/if-youre-so-smart-why-arent-you-rich-turns-out-its-just-chance/ https://www.technologyreview.com/2018/03/01/144958/if-youre-... | http://arxiv.org/abs/1802.07068 http://arxiv.org/abs/1802.07068 ("Talent vs. Luck: The Role of Randomness in Success and Failure") https://ustrustaem.fs.ml.com/content/dam/ust/articles/pdf/2022-BofaA-Private-Bank-Study-of-Wealthy-Americans.pdf https://ustrustaem.fs.ml.com/content/dam/ust/articles/pdf/20... (2022 Bank of America Private Bank Study of Wealthy Americans: The impact of shifting generational attitudes amid an historic wealth transfer) [Only 27% of the ultra wealthy are self made; 70% of Americans who hold more than $3 million are over 56 years old.] https://www.financialsamurai.com/your-wealth-is-mostly-due-to-luck-be-thankful/ https://www.financialsamurai.com/your-wealth-is-mostly-due-t... ("Your Outsized Wealth Is Mostly Due To Luck: Be Thankful!") > And no, parents or grandparents or country or genetics or whatever are not luck either. https://www.pewtrusts.org/en/about/news-room/press-releases-and-statements/2015/07/23/parental-income-has-outsized-influence-on-childrens-economic-future https://www.pewtrusts.org/en/about/news-room/press-releases-... ("Parental Income Has Outsized Influence on Children’s Economic Future") https://documents1.worldbank.org/curated/en/712251468165866186/pdf/946720JRN0Box30LIC00190rest0a000432.pdf https://documents1.worldbank.org/curated/en/7122514681658661... ("Global inequality of opportunity: How much of our income is determined by where we live?") https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-origins-of-mental-illness/202406/genes-influence-childrens-success-directly-and-indirectly https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-origins-of-menta... | https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0002929721002780 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S000292972... ("Genes Influence Children’s Success, Directly and Indirectly") > Choosing a suitable mate is about as close to the meaning of life as we have. ~43% of first marriages fail, ~60% of second marriages, ~73% third marriages. https://www.forbes.com/advisor/legal/divorce/divorce-statistics/ https://www.forbes.com/advisor/legal/divorce/divorce-statist... Good luck.
- deleted 2y ago
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- throwaway22032 2y ago
  Alright, I had previously been lazy but here's a proper response. I'm confused because to me, everything you have posted backs up the idea that these things are in fact actions and not luck based. Country of residence is not luck based, it's either pre-determined or chosen by parents. 27% self made is huge, I would have expected it to be lower. Parental income having an effect on children's is also not an example of luck. If I work hard so that my children do well, that is not luck based. Genes influence success, so choose good genes. 43% of marriages failing simply shows that many people don't take it as seriously as they used to due to things like no fault divorce. So choose well. Your partner, at least the type of person they are, should not be luck based. Your marriage definitely should not feel like a 4 in 10 dice roll, if it does you have really messed up. I think you and I (really, me and most left wing media) have a different definition of luck. Luck is rolling a die and getting a number, these things are more like causative factors. But still, there exist plenty of people who have been born into adversity and study and work hard, network and press the right buttons. That isn't luck, a lottery win is luck. I dunno. It all just feels like a way to absolve one's self from responsibility to me. I did the washing up yesterday, so today I don't have to do it. Is today me lucky that yesterday me did it? Only in the colloquial sense.
  - abenga 2y ago
    Like you said, you have a different definition of luck. Others seem to say "factors that you did not choose, and do not have the ability to change" are luck. > Country of residence is not luck based, it's either pre-determined or chosen by parents. So you have very little to do with it; you can probably choose this after you finish school, but this is dependent on the place you would like to emigrate to letting you in, thus it's mostly not up to you. > Parental income having an effect on children's is also not an example of luck. If I work hard so that my children do well, that is not luck based. If I get the resources to do well because my parents worked hard, that is really not something I choose, so it's "luck". > Genes influence success, so choose good genes. One can hardly choose their own genes, can they? > But still, there exist plenty of people who have been born into adversity and study and work hard, network and press the right buttons. This is true. They would have had an easier time and achieved more if they did not have to dig out of the basement first before building up. Nobody is saying that you cannot be smart and diligent enough to change your lot in life, we are just saying it is hard, getting harder every day, and it should not be.

toomuchtodo 2y ago

> It sounds as if you have an emotional issue with the idea that people can change their own situation. On the contrary, I am simply data informed. It sounds like you're operating from a mental model that overweighs ability in outcomes. I have provided links below to help you improve and evolve this model. https://www.scientificamerican.com/blog/beautiful-minds/the-role-of-luck-in-life-success-is-far-greater-than-we-realized/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/blog/beautiful-minds/the-... ("The Role of Luck in Life Success Is Far Greater Than We Realized") https://www.technologyreview.com/2018/03/01/144958/if-youre-so-smart-why-arent-you-rich-turns-out-its-just-chance/ https://www.technologyreview.com/2018/03/01/144958/if-youre-... | http://arxiv.org/abs/1802.07068 http://arxiv.org/abs/1802.07068 ("Talent vs. Luck: The Role of Randomness in Success and Failure") https://ustrustaem.fs.ml.com/content/dam/ust/articles/pdf/2022-BofaA-Private-Bank-Study-of-Wealthy-Americans.pdf https://ustrustaem.fs.ml.com/content/dam/ust/articles/pdf/20... (2022 Bank of America Private Bank Study of Wealthy Americans: The impact of shifting generational attitudes amid an historic wealth transfer) [Only 27% of the ultra wealthy are self made; 70% of Americans who hold more than $3 million are over 56 years old.] https://www.financialsamurai.com/your-wealth-is-mostly-due-to-luck-be-thankful/ https://www.financialsamurai.com/your-wealth-is-mostly-due-t... ("Your Outsized Wealth Is Mostly Due To Luck: Be Thankful!") > And no, parents or grandparents or country or genetics or whatever are not luck either. https://www.pewtrusts.org/en/about/news-room/press-releases-and-statements/2015/07/23/parental-income-has-outsized-influence-on-childrens-economic-future https://www.pewtrusts.org/en/about/news-room/press-releases-... ("Parental Income Has Outsized Influence on Children’s Economic Future") https://documents1.worldbank.org/curated/en/712251468165866186/pdf/946720JRN0Box30LIC00190rest0a000432.pdf https://documents1.worldbank.org/curated/en/7122514681658661... ("Global inequality of opportunity: How much of our income is determined by where we live?") https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-origins-of-mental-illness/202406/genes-influence-childrens-success-directly-and-indirectly https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-origins-of-menta... | https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0002929721002780 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S000292972... ("Genes Influence Children’s Success, Directly and Indirectly") > Choosing a suitable mate is about as close to the meaning of life as we have. ~43% of first marriages fail, ~60% of second marriages, ~73% third marriages. https://www.forbes.com/advisor/legal/divorce/divorce-statistics/ https://www.forbes.com/advisor/legal/divorce/divorce-statist... Good luck.

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
throwaway22032 2y ago
Alright, I had previously been lazy but here's a proper response. I'm confused because to me, everything you have posted backs up the idea that these things are in fact actions and not luck based. Country of residence is not luck based, it's either pre-determined or chosen by parents. 27% self made is huge, I would have expected it to be lower. Parental income having an effect on children's is also not an example of luck. If I work hard so that my children do well, that is not luck based. Genes influence success, so choose good genes. 43% of marriages failing simply shows that many people don't take it as seriously as they used to due to things like no fault divorce. So choose well. Your partner, at least the type of person they are, should not be luck based. Your marriage definitely should not feel like a 4 in 10 dice roll, if it does you have really messed up. I think you and I (really, me and most left wing media) have a different definition of luck. Luck is rolling a die and getting a number, these things are more like causative factors. But still, there exist plenty of people who have been born into adversity and study and work hard, network and press the right buttons. That isn't luck, a lottery win is luck. I dunno. It all just feels like a way to absolve one's self from responsibility to me. I did the washing up yesterday, so today I don't have to do it. Is today me lucky that yesterday me did it? Only in the colloquial sense.
- abenga 2y ago
  Like you said, you have a different definition of luck. Others seem to say "factors that you did not choose, and do not have the ability to change" are luck. > Country of residence is not luck based, it's either pre-determined or chosen by parents. So you have very little to do with it; you can probably choose this after you finish school, but this is dependent on the place you would like to emigrate to letting you in, thus it's mostly not up to you. > Parental income having an effect on children's is also not an example of luck. If I work hard so that my children do well, that is not luck based. If I get the resources to do well because my parents worked hard, that is really not something I choose, so it's "luck". > Genes influence success, so choose good genes. One can hardly choose their own genes, can they? > But still, there exist plenty of people who have been born into adversity and study and work hard, network and press the right buttons. This is true. They would have had an easier time and achieved more if they did not have to dig out of the basement first before building up. Nobody is saying that you cannot be smart and diligent enough to change your lot in life, we are just saying it is hard, getting harder every day, and it should not be.