3 ms·

Compare and contrast with Texas.

by wumeow 2y ago

batch12 2y ago
Or with past California
toomuchtodo 2y ago
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40908526 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40908526
gretch 2y ago
Why? Why does this new innovation in the california grid have to be all about dunking on texas? (As a californian) It's especially annoying coming from anyone californian, the state of Enron and PGE wildfires. Like we are so caught up in the vanity of comparison that we quickly rush to forgive our past sins while condemning the mistakes of others for forever and ever. How about as technologists, we just focus on innovating (which is not a zero sum game) and we don't compare ourselves to people who aren't doing as well.
- baq 2y ago
  I’m in Europe and I can pick on Texas all day on energy. The separate grid is a self-inflicted gunshot wound in both feet.
  - spacedcowboy 2y ago
    Well, they do like their guns in Texas
  - bravetraveler 2y ago
    I live in Texas and support your message. We get cheap power and have cheap results [under stress] to show for it, repeatedly
  - Dma54rhs 2y ago
    Then you should also know the way they run their energy network is similar to our euro free energy markets. Many many people in Europe pay spot price, the kind that people on HN freaked out when the pricing went crazy is pretty normal in EU.
  - msandford 2y ago
    How so? Would the Federal regulators have done a better job of making CenterPoint invest the right amount of money into tree trimming and placing lines underground? California is under Federal regulation and has significant problems where PG&E hasn't invested enough in reliability. If California just breezed through every natural disaster with no power outages and lower than Texas energy prices it would truly be a no brainer. But Texas has retail power rates in the $0.10-$0.20/kwh range. From what I understand $0.20 would be an absolute bargain in California and that $0.30-$0.50 per kwh is more what folks out there pay. It's not so compelling in that case. Of course I could have missed something. Please do let me know if I have.
    - nine_k 2y ago
      Hitting a company with fines for not doing maintenance required by regulation, when the fines cost more than compliance, works well. Given sensible regulations, of course. Look at airlines: rather strict and reasonably good safety regulations made flying the safest form of transportation, safer than driving and maybe even walking. Nevertheless, we don't see exorbitant prices either; if anything, the cost of air travel is surprisingly low, often competitive with rail, even in EU. Of course, unreasonable regulations are a bane, see the leaded fuel situation in general aviation, or the whole nuclear industry.
    - schmookeeg 2y ago
      Hello from Alameda, CA. 15.5c per kwh here except for M-F 5pm-9pm, where it is 50c.
      - msandford 2y ago
        Oh wow! Thanks for the info. I'm glad to hear it's not crazy everywhere out there.
- jfengel 2y ago
  Because, despite having vast amounts of renewables, Texas is a key political contributor to our lack of a cohesive national strategy for ditching fossil fuels. Its national politicians regularly insist that climate change is a hoax. If a few decades of trying to use rationality have failed, I'm all for calling attention to their own local failures. If "dunking" on them is in bad faith, it is only because good faith arguments have failed so consistently.
kccqzy 2y ago
Texas is the number two state in grid battery. No other state comes close to either California or Texas.
- jeffbee 2y ago
  Texas has added a massive amount of batteries in a year or two. Worth noting, however, that as a fraction of their peak load California has about 3x as many batteries as Texas, because Texas uses far more energy and has much less rooftop solar. So while they are in the 2nd position it seems like a fairly distant 2nd.
jmugan 2y ago
I dislike right-wing silliness as much as anyone, but this whole hate against Texas is just weird. We had Montana winter weather for a week and our grid went down. I had a business partner in California during a period a few years back and we had to reschedule meetings around when he would have electricity. We should just focus on doing better instead of fighting.
- skhunted 2y ago
  The hate as you call it is not weird. It’s a reasonable response to a state that consistently enacts laws and regulations that hurt the people. You get what you vote for and people in other states have to put up with idiotic Texas politicians who vote against hurricane Sandy aid while later requesting help. Texas deserves far more “hate” than it gets.
  - jmugan 2y ago
    You don't have to see the world in such stark terms. There is plenty of silliness everywhere.
    - skhunted 2y ago
      Not all silliness is equal or equally stupid. The Texas legislature routinely calls for secession when a Democrat wins the Presidency and votes to stymie federal aid to other states while demanding federal aid for themselves. I don’t see the world in stark terms except where appropriate. You do believe cases exist where such views are warranted right? I happen to think that Texas qualifies.
      - telotortium 2y ago
        California demands just as much federal aid, and perhaps more - they budgeted assuming that COVID-era federal funding would last forever, until they were recently forced to cut after having to face their absurd assumptions. San Francisco's city government also attempted to boycott working with any contractor in 30 states based on their political views, until it was forced to relent due to not being able to find contractors at an acceptable price.

Compare and contrast with Texas.

by wumeow 2y ago

Compare and contrast with Texas.

batch12 2y ago

Or with past California

toomuchtodo 2y ago

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40908526 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40908526

gretch 2y ago

Why? Why does this new innovation in the california grid have to be all about dunking on texas? (As a californian) It's especially annoying coming from anyone californian, the state of Enron and PGE wildfires. Like we are so caught up in the vanity of comparison that we quickly rush to forgive our past sins while condemning the mistakes of others for forever and ever. How about as technologists, we just focus on innovating (which is not a zero sum game) and we don't compare ourselves to people who aren't doing as well.

baq 2y ago
I’m in Europe and I can pick on Texas all day on energy. The separate grid is a self-inflicted gunshot wound in both feet.
- spacedcowboy 2y ago
  Well, they do like their guns in Texas
- bravetraveler 2y ago
  I live in Texas and support your message. We get cheap power and have cheap results [under stress] to show for it, repeatedly
- Dma54rhs 2y ago
  Then you should also know the way they run their energy network is similar to our euro free energy markets. Many many people in Europe pay spot price, the kind that people on HN freaked out when the pricing went crazy is pretty normal in EU.
- msandford 2y ago
  How so? Would the Federal regulators have done a better job of making CenterPoint invest the right amount of money into tree trimming and placing lines underground? California is under Federal regulation and has significant problems where PG&E hasn't invested enough in reliability. If California just breezed through every natural disaster with no power outages and lower than Texas energy prices it would truly be a no brainer. But Texas has retail power rates in the $0.10-$0.20/kwh range. From what I understand $0.20 would be an absolute bargain in California and that $0.30-$0.50 per kwh is more what folks out there pay. It's not so compelling in that case. Of course I could have missed something. Please do let me know if I have.
  - nine_k 2y ago
    Hitting a company with fines for not doing maintenance required by regulation, when the fines cost more than compliance, works well. Given sensible regulations, of course. Look at airlines: rather strict and reasonably good safety regulations made flying the safest form of transportation, safer than driving and maybe even walking. Nevertheless, we don't see exorbitant prices either; if anything, the cost of air travel is surprisingly low, often competitive with rail, even in EU. Of course, unreasonable regulations are a bane, see the leaded fuel situation in general aviation, or the whole nuclear industry.
  - schmookeeg 2y ago
    Hello from Alameda, CA. 15.5c per kwh here except for M-F 5pm-9pm, where it is 50c.
    - msandford 2y ago
      Oh wow! Thanks for the info. I'm glad to hear it's not crazy everywhere out there.
jfengel 2y ago
Because, despite having vast amounts of renewables, Texas is a key political contributor to our lack of a cohesive national strategy for ditching fossil fuels. Its national politicians regularly insist that climate change is a hoax. If a few decades of trying to use rationality have failed, I'm all for calling attention to their own local failures. If "dunking" on them is in bad faith, it is only because good faith arguments have failed so consistently.

kccqzy 2y ago

Texas is the number two state in grid battery. No other state comes close to either California or Texas.

jeffbee 2y ago
Texas has added a massive amount of batteries in a year or two. Worth noting, however, that as a fraction of their peak load California has about 3x as many batteries as Texas, because Texas uses far more energy and has much less rooftop solar. So while they are in the 2nd position it seems like a fairly distant 2nd.

jmugan 2y ago

I dislike right-wing silliness as much as anyone, but this whole hate against Texas is just weird. We had Montana winter weather for a week and our grid went down. I had a business partner in California during a period a few years back and we had to reschedule meetings around when he would have electricity. We should just focus on doing better instead of fighting.

skhunted 2y ago
The hate as you call it is not weird. It’s a reasonable response to a state that consistently enacts laws and regulations that hurt the people. You get what you vote for and people in other states have to put up with idiotic Texas politicians who vote against hurricane Sandy aid while later requesting help. Texas deserves far more “hate” than it gets.
- jmugan 2y ago
  You don't have to see the world in such stark terms. There is plenty of silliness everywhere.
  - skhunted 2y ago
    Not all silliness is equal or equally stupid. The Texas legislature routinely calls for secession when a Democrat wins the Presidency and votes to stymie federal aid to other states while demanding federal aid for themselves. I don’t see the world in stark terms except where appropriate. You do believe cases exist where such views are warranted right? I happen to think that Texas qualifies.
    - telotortium 2y ago
      California demands just as much federal aid, and perhaps more - they budgeted assuming that COVID-era federal funding would last forever, until they were recently forced to cut after having to face their absurd assumptions. San Francisco's city government also attempted to boycott working with any contractor in 30 states based on their political views, until it was forced to relent due to not being able to find contractors at an acceptable price.