6 ms·

He has been compared to Hitler countless times, and was demonized by the media for years, meanwhile his supporters were dismissed as lunatics and conspiracy the

by proc0 2y ago

He has been compared to Hitler countless times, and was demonized by the media for years, meanwhile his supporters were dismissed as lunatics and conspiracy theorists when this is pointed out. We literally almost had civil war or at least a real insurrection today.

meiraleal 2y ago
[flagged]
- christophilus 2y ago
  If you look through history at insurrections, whatever January 6 was, it doesn’t seem to be in that category. If it is in the same category, it’s one of the lamest, most peaceful, bungled insurrections on the books. It looks more like a rowdy protest, and that’s probably what it was.
  - meiraleal 2y ago
    A lame insurrection is still an insurrection. When was the last time the US Capitol was stormed by organized revolted people?
    - typeofhuman 2y ago
      April 9, 2024 https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2024/04/09/israel-gaza-war-protest-cafeteria-dirksen-senate-capitol-dc/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2024/04/09/israel-ga...
      - klyrs 2y ago
        The Senate Cafeteria Insurrection of '24? No, blockading the lunch counter doesn't compare to violently interrupting the count of electoral votes. They didn't even beat up any cops. They didn't "storm" the building, they orderly unfurled their protest signs and peacefully got arrested.
        typeofhuman 2y ago
        You're adding new conditions so that you don't have to accept my answer. Your original question: > When was the last time the US Capitol was stormed by organized revolted people Want more? October 2023. Protest broke out causing police to shut down roads outside the Capitol. And they did ASSAULT COPS. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2023/10/19/israel-hamas-protesters-swarm-house-buidling-washington-arrests/71237857007/ https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2023/10/19/israel... https://nypost.com/2023/10/18/chaos-erupts-as-pro-palestinian-protesters-take-to-the-capitol-at-least-three-arrested/ https://nypost.com/2023/10/18/chaos-erupts-as-pro-palestinia...
        typeofhuman 2y ago
        Downvoted for providing you the evidence you asked for. Cognitive dissonance at its finest.
    - proc0 2y ago
      Do you really think they were going to take over the government if they took over the building or stopped whatever process was going on? Why? The military would have taken back that building in 10 seconds, and the process can be postponed till the next day or the next week. Nothing was at danger, that is not how a country functions. You need an armed militia or at least half of the military to take over.
      - Timon3 2y ago
        > Do you really think they were going to take over the government if they took over the building or stopped whatever process was going on? Why? No, and I don't know anybody who thinks like this, because it's a misrepresentation of the insurrection that happened. The danger was never that some random person sits down in a government chair and suddenly becomes the new government. > The military would have taken back that building in 10 seconds, and the process can be postponed till the next day or the next week. And that's what the republicans counted on - they wanted the election process to be interrupted, which would (according to their reading) have allowed Pence to count the fake electors they provided. And who could have stopped them? The supreme court they stacked? That's the insurrection. Do you disagree with any of this? All of it is quite well documented. > Nothing was at danger, that is not how a country functions. You need an armed militia or at least half of the military to take over. If not for the actions of a few individuals, the sitting president would have literally overturned the election results. That's absolutely a huge danger to the country. You don't need an armed militia if half the politicians are working together with the insurrectionists.
        proc0 2y ago
        > they wanted the election process to be interrupted, which would (according to their reading) have allowed Pence to count the fake electors they provided. That's the insurrection. I'm trying to understand, you are saying that the military would have showed up and forced Pence to overturn the election? Or what did I miss? I'm saying even if the protesters would have taken the building, the national guard takes it back immediately, and the electors get certified the next day in another building. In this scenario the national guard is not joining in on the effort in any way. It would just delay it. I could see how it could be a real threat to the election if there was proof of a large coordinated effort with firearms, by which I mean people conspired to actually takeover the building and launched a plan to do it, as oppose to a large mob with bad actors.
  - JasserInicide 2y ago
    Yup. It was just a bunch of people who just wanted to show up and say they were there and basically just pushed their luck with how far they could get into the Capitol building. There was little if any organization to it all. It was not the murderous democracy-threatening insurrection as the Democrats have repeatedly said it was. And as another poster said further up, their years of overblown fearmongering is what led to what happened today.
    - trealira 2y ago
      That's not true; there was a great deal of planning by the Proud Boys and the Oath Keepers. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planning_of_the_January_6_United_States_Capitol_attack https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planning_of_the_January_6_Unit...
      - proc0 2y ago
        They were in the minority of the crowd, and I think this is supported by how many people were charged with conspiracy (not to mention how many were charged with anything other than trespassing).
      - Blackstrat 2y ago
        [flagged]
        PicassoCTs 2y ago
        There are no conspiracies. None. Everything comes out to daylight. Ever faster. What you see, is what you got. There is no backroom plot. Just bumbling idiots and "great-man" captains in operetta uniforms, singing arias on how they control the world, while there steering wheels are attached to nothing. All you have, is the species as is, as it becomes when exposed to a environment that is hostile to the basic things holding society together. Slurped for the nutrients by meta-organisms, the great stomach of society heaves as the still alive things inside, fight the lining and each other to get out of the acid.
  - bravetraveler 2y ago
    People died at that 'rowdy protest', why are you downplaying this?
    - throwaway4aday 2y ago
      Why were the deaths at all the other rowdy protests downplayed?
      - bravetraveler 2y ago
        ... what[about]? I don't have the preconditioning, information, or involvement this question relies on. People dying as part of 'protest'/civil unrest/whatever is disgusting. It shouldn't be downplayed. My argument/point is that what pulled me in nears propaganda. The same sense I get here. Humanity, please. Jan 6th was a bit beyond what was stated, is all. Not interested in seeing how deep the rabbit hole goes
  - pvaldes 2y ago
    > it’s one of the lamest, most peaceful, bungled insurrections on the books Some people died that day But the real problem is to miss the multilayered nature of this operations.
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
- Andrew_nenakhov 2y ago
  Yes, by a crowd of gun owners who inconveniently forgot to take their guns with them when they decided to go and overthrow the government, right.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - tristan957 2y ago
    Isn't it possibly that most of the rioters were from outside of DC? From what I can tell DC concealed carry reciprocity is very low.
  - Timon3 2y ago
    Multiple people were convicted of carrying firearms inside the Capitol on Jan 6th, and it's been documented that weapon caches were prepared close by.
    - Andrew_nenakhov 2y ago
      You must be pretty concerned with this topic, leaving several identical comments in various branches of the discussion. Since you seem to possess a significant amount of knowledge on this subject, so I have a question for you: who was charged with organizing and staging insurrection? From what I know about the US penal code, it is a very serious crime
      - Timon3 2y ago
        I think it's important to correct misinformation on such important topics. Many people point to these wrong facts as evidence that things aren't that bad - which makes it even more important to correct things, as this apparently was an important factor in their previous assessment. Why are you asking me this question on a completely unrelated comment? Since my comment didn't touch on this subject at all, and since it's much faster to look this up yourself than to ask me, you must have some specific reason to ask me. What is it?
- _zagj 2y ago
  How would you characterize the 2020 Floyd riots, which caused an estimated $1-2 billion of damage (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Floyd_protests https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Floyd_protests) and resulted in Trump at one point being taken to a White House security bunker by the Secret Service for his safety? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vho8ueAAtaY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vho8ueAAtaY I'll never understand how all of this was memory-holed to such a degree, and in such a short span of time (six months), that the pearl-clutching over Jan 6 didn't seem completely ridiculous and hypocritical to most people.
  - Gibbon1 2y ago
    Well in Oakland a federal officer was murdered by right-wing extremists. https://www.courthousenews.com/two-charged-in-murder-of-oakland-federal-officer-during-protests/ https://www.courthousenews.com/two-charged-in-murder-of-oakl... Not the Floyd protests but there is your fellow traveler who attacked Polosi's husband with a hammer. https://www.reuters.com/world/us/man-who-attacked-pelosis-husband-sentenced-30-years-prison-2024-05-17/ https://www.reuters.com/world/us/man-who-attacked-pelosis-hu... There is the conservative who planned on killing people at the ACLU and tides foundation. https://www.marinatimes.com/aug10/news_presidiotides.html https://www.marinatimes.com/aug10/news_presidiotides.html https://www.marinatimes.com/aug10/news_presidiotides.html https://www.marinatimes.com/aug10/news_presidiotides.html
    - _zagj 2y ago
      > your fellow traveler I didn't vote for Trump in 2016, but having had to deal with taking care of my aging, disabled parents in 2020 in a city heavily affected by the riots (and COVID), I was and remain bitter about the media inciting the riots, and then the media and progressive politicians enabling and excusing the rioters ("mostly peaceful protests"), all before memory-holing everything for the sake of political expediency.
      - robxorb 2y ago
        "Firey but peaceful" were the immortal words uttered by on-location CNN anchor Don Lemon before being hit by a bottle, as arson raged behind him and dozens of people were killed. Conversely, one protestor who was unarmed was killed on J6. (And before someone "corrects" that - four people died at the capitol, but, two were natural causes and one was from drugs. Given the number of people was easily in the high hundreds K, statistically that's less than should generally be expected.)
- proc0 2y ago
  The amount of lies told by the news, media, and government (in general) are too much to list in a short comment. This has always been clearly visible for anybody that is not completely brainwashed by propaganda. The Iraq war was based on lies, just to name one of the major examples of how the government controls the perceptions of the populace. You can't claim half of the country is supporting a dictator and compare him to Hitler and not realize that that is civil war level rhetoric. The logical conclusion is to use any means necessary to prevent that... yet ironically that distorted reality is what is causing it. Let's hope things cool down.
- jdkee 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - Timon3 2y ago
    [flagged]
  - ath3nd 2y ago
    .... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZL-8gBt0fgU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZL-8gBt0fgU https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justice-department/jan-6-rioter-charged-police-carrying-gun-sentenced-7-years-rcna94940 https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justice-department/jan-6-ri... https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justice-department/trump-supporter-charged-firing-gun-jan-6-capitol-attack-rcna142538 https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justice-department/trump-su... Please, stop

by proc0 2y ago

meiraleal 2y ago

[flagged]

christophilus 2y ago
If you look through history at insurrections, whatever January 6 was, it doesn’t seem to be in that category. If it is in the same category, it’s one of the lamest, most peaceful, bungled insurrections on the books. It looks more like a rowdy protest, and that’s probably what it was.
- meiraleal 2y ago
  A lame insurrection is still an insurrection. When was the last time the US Capitol was stormed by organized revolted people?
  - typeofhuman 2y ago
    April 9, 2024 https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2024/04/09/israel-gaza-war-protest-cafeteria-dirksen-senate-capitol-dc/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2024/04/09/israel-ga...
    - klyrs 2y ago
      The Senate Cafeteria Insurrection of '24? No, blockading the lunch counter doesn't compare to violently interrupting the count of electoral votes. They didn't even beat up any cops. They didn't "storm" the building, they orderly unfurled their protest signs and peacefully got arrested.
      - typeofhuman 2y ago
        You're adding new conditions so that you don't have to accept my answer. Your original question: > When was the last time the US Capitol was stormed by organized revolted people Want more? October 2023. Protest broke out causing police to shut down roads outside the Capitol. And they did ASSAULT COPS. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2023/10/19/israel-hamas-protesters-swarm-house-buidling-washington-arrests/71237857007/ https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2023/10/19/israel... https://nypost.com/2023/10/18/chaos-erupts-as-pro-palestinian-protesters-take-to-the-capitol-at-least-three-arrested/ https://nypost.com/2023/10/18/chaos-erupts-as-pro-palestinia...
        typeofhuman 2y ago
        Downvoted for providing you the evidence you asked for. Cognitive dissonance at its finest.
  - proc0 2y ago
    Do you really think they were going to take over the government if they took over the building or stopped whatever process was going on? Why? The military would have taken back that building in 10 seconds, and the process can be postponed till the next day or the next week. Nothing was at danger, that is not how a country functions. You need an armed militia or at least half of the military to take over.
    - Timon3 2y ago
      > Do you really think they were going to take over the government if they took over the building or stopped whatever process was going on? Why? No, and I don't know anybody who thinks like this, because it's a misrepresentation of the insurrection that happened. The danger was never that some random person sits down in a government chair and suddenly becomes the new government. > The military would have taken back that building in 10 seconds, and the process can be postponed till the next day or the next week. And that's what the republicans counted on - they wanted the election process to be interrupted, which would (according to their reading) have allowed Pence to count the fake electors they provided. And who could have stopped them? The supreme court they stacked? That's the insurrection. Do you disagree with any of this? All of it is quite well documented. > Nothing was at danger, that is not how a country functions. You need an armed militia or at least half of the military to take over. If not for the actions of a few individuals, the sitting president would have literally overturned the election results. That's absolutely a huge danger to the country. You don't need an armed militia if half the politicians are working together with the insurrectionists.
      - proc0 2y ago
        > they wanted the election process to be interrupted, which would (according to their reading) have allowed Pence to count the fake electors they provided. That's the insurrection. I'm trying to understand, you are saying that the military would have showed up and forced Pence to overturn the election? Or what did I miss? I'm saying even if the protesters would have taken the building, the national guard takes it back immediately, and the electors get certified the next day in another building. In this scenario the national guard is not joining in on the effort in any way. It would just delay it. I could see how it could be a real threat to the election if there was proof of a large coordinated effort with firearms, by which I mean people conspired to actually takeover the building and launched a plan to do it, as oppose to a large mob with bad actors.
- JasserInicide 2y ago
  Yup. It was just a bunch of people who just wanted to show up and say they were there and basically just pushed their luck with how far they could get into the Capitol building. There was little if any organization to it all. It was not the murderous democracy-threatening insurrection as the Democrats have repeatedly said it was. And as another poster said further up, their years of overblown fearmongering is what led to what happened today.
  - trealira 2y ago
    That's not true; there was a great deal of planning by the Proud Boys and the Oath Keepers. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planning_of_the_January_6_United_States_Capitol_attack https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planning_of_the_January_6_Unit...
    - proc0 2y ago
      They were in the minority of the crowd, and I think this is supported by how many people were charged with conspiracy (not to mention how many were charged with anything other than trespassing).
    - Blackstrat 2y ago
      [flagged]
      - PicassoCTs 2y ago
        There are no conspiracies. None. Everything comes out to daylight. Ever faster. What you see, is what you got. There is no backroom plot. Just bumbling idiots and "great-man" captains in operetta uniforms, singing arias on how they control the world, while there steering wheels are attached to nothing. All you have, is the species as is, as it becomes when exposed to a environment that is hostile to the basic things holding society together. Slurped for the nutrients by meta-organisms, the great stomach of society heaves as the still alive things inside, fight the lining and each other to get out of the acid.
- bravetraveler 2y ago
  People died at that 'rowdy protest', why are you downplaying this?
  - throwaway4aday 2y ago
    Why were the deaths at all the other rowdy protests downplayed?
    - bravetraveler 2y ago
      ... what[about]? I don't have the preconditioning, information, or involvement this question relies on. People dying as part of 'protest'/civil unrest/whatever is disgusting. It shouldn't be downplayed. My argument/point is that what pulled me in nears propaganda. The same sense I get here. Humanity, please. Jan 6th was a bit beyond what was stated, is all. Not interested in seeing how deep the rabbit hole goes
- pvaldes 2y ago
  > it’s one of the lamest, most peaceful, bungled insurrections on the books Some people died that day But the real problem is to miss the multilayered nature of this operations.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
Andrew_nenakhov 2y ago
Yes, by a crowd of gun owners who inconveniently forgot to take their guns with them when they decided to go and overthrow the government, right.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- tristan957 2y ago
  Isn't it possibly that most of the rioters were from outside of DC? From what I can tell DC concealed carry reciprocity is very low.
- Timon3 2y ago
  Multiple people were convicted of carrying firearms inside the Capitol on Jan 6th, and it's been documented that weapon caches were prepared close by.
  - Andrew_nenakhov 2y ago
    You must be pretty concerned with this topic, leaving several identical comments in various branches of the discussion. Since you seem to possess a significant amount of knowledge on this subject, so I have a question for you: who was charged with organizing and staging insurrection? From what I know about the US penal code, it is a very serious crime
    - Timon3 2y ago
      I think it's important to correct misinformation on such important topics. Many people point to these wrong facts as evidence that things aren't that bad - which makes it even more important to correct things, as this apparently was an important factor in their previous assessment. Why are you asking me this question on a completely unrelated comment? Since my comment didn't touch on this subject at all, and since it's much faster to look this up yourself than to ask me, you must have some specific reason to ask me. What is it?
_zagj 2y ago
How would you characterize the 2020 Floyd riots, which caused an estimated $1-2 billion of damage (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Floyd_protests https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Floyd_protests) and resulted in Trump at one point being taken to a White House security bunker by the Secret Service for his safety? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vho8ueAAtaY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vho8ueAAtaY I'll never understand how all of this was memory-holed to such a degree, and in such a short span of time (six months), that the pearl-clutching over Jan 6 didn't seem completely ridiculous and hypocritical to most people.
- Gibbon1 2y ago
  Well in Oakland a federal officer was murdered by right-wing extremists. https://www.courthousenews.com/two-charged-in-murder-of-oakland-federal-officer-during-protests/ https://www.courthousenews.com/two-charged-in-murder-of-oakl... Not the Floyd protests but there is your fellow traveler who attacked Polosi's husband with a hammer. https://www.reuters.com/world/us/man-who-attacked-pelosis-husband-sentenced-30-years-prison-2024-05-17/ https://www.reuters.com/world/us/man-who-attacked-pelosis-hu... There is the conservative who planned on killing people at the ACLU and tides foundation. https://www.marinatimes.com/aug10/news_presidiotides.html https://www.marinatimes.com/aug10/news_presidiotides.html https://www.marinatimes.com/aug10/news_presidiotides.html https://www.marinatimes.com/aug10/news_presidiotides.html
  - _zagj 2y ago
    > your fellow traveler I didn't vote for Trump in 2016, but having had to deal with taking care of my aging, disabled parents in 2020 in a city heavily affected by the riots (and COVID), I was and remain bitter about the media inciting the riots, and then the media and progressive politicians enabling and excusing the rioters ("mostly peaceful protests"), all before memory-holing everything for the sake of political expediency.
    - robxorb 2y ago
      "Firey but peaceful" were the immortal words uttered by on-location CNN anchor Don Lemon before being hit by a bottle, as arson raged behind him and dozens of people were killed. Conversely, one protestor who was unarmed was killed on J6. (And before someone "corrects" that - four people died at the capitol, but, two were natural causes and one was from drugs. Given the number of people was easily in the high hundreds K, statistically that's less than should generally be expected.)
proc0 2y ago
The amount of lies told by the news, media, and government (in general) are too much to list in a short comment. This has always been clearly visible for anybody that is not completely brainwashed by propaganda. The Iraq war was based on lies, just to name one of the major examples of how the government controls the perceptions of the populace. You can't claim half of the country is supporting a dictator and compare him to Hitler and not realize that that is civil war level rhetoric. The logical conclusion is to use any means necessary to prevent that... yet ironically that distorted reality is what is causing it. Let's hope things cool down.
jdkee 2y ago
[flagged]
- Timon3 2y ago
  [flagged]
- ath3nd 2y ago
  .... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZL-8gBt0fgU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZL-8gBt0fgU https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justice-department/jan-6-rioter-charged-police-carrying-gun-sentenced-7-years-rcna94940 https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justice-department/jan-6-ri... https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justice-department/trump-supporter-charged-firing-gun-jan-6-capitol-attack-rcna142538 https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/justice-department/trump-su... Please, stop