4 ms·

They are right. It is good. They call it satire, but still I think the stuff they mention is right; yes it should look like this and shouldn't need pictures and

They are right. It is good. They call it satire, but still I think the stuff they mention is right; yes it should look like this and shouldn't need pictures and CSS and whatever else they add too much. Also, it works with "http:" and with "https:", so that is also good. Another benefit is that I do not have to override or disable the CSS to make it even partially good, because it does not have CSS. It works how it is, unlike most. However: - The <meta charset> command should not be needed, if the text is only ASCII anyways. - The <meta name="viewport"> command should not be needed, if they use the simple HTML as this anyways (without CSS); the client should ought to set it automatically according to the user-defined window size. - They even have a <script> command (with Google Analytics), which also should not be needed. They have a comment if you wanna fight about it. (I have scripts disabled.)

cortesoft 2y ago
> yes it should look like this and shouldn't need pictures and CSS and whatever else it might need Isn’t this entirely dependent on what the purpose of the website is? If i am visiting a website to learn about different types of flowers, for example, I sure hope there are some pictures of flowers on it.
- zzo38computer 2y ago
  Yes, if you are trying to view pictures of flowers, then you are right. They should not add the pictures merely for decorations, but if you want to view a document explaining flowers then it is helpful to include the pictures of the flowers being described. (Similar thing is valid for other kind of documents that might have pictures of whatever is being described, but many documents should not need as many pictures as they too often have.)
  - cortesoft 2y ago
    Why are things “merely for decorations” bad? A ton of what we do in the world is for aesthetic reasons, why shouldn’t that include web content? Things looking nice is an important thing for many people.
    - zzo38computer 2y ago
      Wastes space on the screen (especially if you have to scroll the screen to read it, or if you want to print it out and you want to save paper and ink), might sometimes make it more difficult to understand (in case you do not know what is the significance of the picture), and can use up power and disk space, etc. However, sometimes it might help if you can specify which ones are merely for decoration and what is what, that you can easily disable them and to avoid downloading them. (Even if a picture is meant to be a significant part of the document because it is what it is about, then you still might not want to download it right away although it would help to display a placeholder (e.g. a hyperlink) in that case.)
zamadatix 2y ago
I used to be of the "and things on the web should all support http unless they really need https" crowd but corporations (ISPs, hotels, airports) driven by the ad sales industry really drove me to the "nah, we should really get everything on https" crowd. <meta charset="utf-8"> means not assuming the default encoding of the client at all, not that ASCII would be invalid given the site's content. Edit: Forgot <meta name="viewport" content="width=device-width, initial-scale=1">, you probably want this even without CSS. What the client ought to do and what the client does do are different stories and neither are guaranteed to be what you want in the end anyways.
- zzo38computer 2y ago
  > I used to be of the "and things on the web should all support http unless they really need https" crowd Supporting unencrypted connections does not imply that the client is required to use them. > What the client ought to do and what the client does do are different stories and neither are guaranteed to be what you want in the end anyways. Yes, which is why the reader should configure how they intend it to be and the document author should not prevent it from working how the reader intended.
  - zamadatix 2y ago
    Supporting both is part of the problem unfortunately. In principle I agree on how the user agent should behave, in practice leaving viewport as default doesn't necessarily match what the user wants or what the developer wants. E.g. user zoom settings are still applied after the viewport scale setting, just now in a consistent way across mobile devices.
threatofrain 2y ago
https should be used just about everywhere. We should no longer be assuming that we live in a world where people won't fuck with you. If you don't have https then someone can change your website so hard... that you're basically allowing someone to use your credibility to speak to your visitors. The social engineering potential is limited only by imagination.

cortesoft 2y ago

> yes it should look like this and shouldn't need pictures and CSS and whatever else it might need Isn’t this entirely dependent on what the purpose of the website is? If i am visiting a website to learn about different types of flowers, for example, I sure hope there are some pictures of flowers on it.

zzo38computer 2y ago
Yes, if you are trying to view pictures of flowers, then you are right. They should not add the pictures merely for decorations, but if you want to view a document explaining flowers then it is helpful to include the pictures of the flowers being described. (Similar thing is valid for other kind of documents that might have pictures of whatever is being described, but many documents should not need as many pictures as they too often have.)
- cortesoft 2y ago
  Why are things “merely for decorations” bad? A ton of what we do in the world is for aesthetic reasons, why shouldn’t that include web content? Things looking nice is an important thing for many people.
  - zzo38computer 2y ago
    Wastes space on the screen (especially if you have to scroll the screen to read it, or if you want to print it out and you want to save paper and ink), might sometimes make it more difficult to understand (in case you do not know what is the significance of the picture), and can use up power and disk space, etc. However, sometimes it might help if you can specify which ones are merely for decoration and what is what, that you can easily disable them and to avoid downloading them. (Even if a picture is meant to be a significant part of the document because it is what it is about, then you still might not want to download it right away although it would help to display a placeholder (e.g. a hyperlink) in that case.)

zamadatix 2y ago

I used to be of the "and things on the web should all support http unless they really need https" crowd but corporations (ISPs, hotels, airports) driven by the ad sales industry really drove me to the "nah, we should really get everything on https" crowd. <meta charset="utf-8"> means not assuming the default encoding of the client at all, not that ASCII would be invalid given the site's content. Edit: Forgot <meta name="viewport" content="width=device-width, initial-scale=1">, you probably want this even without CSS. What the client ought to do and what the client does do are different stories and neither are guaranteed to be what you want in the end anyways.

zzo38computer 2y ago
> I used to be of the "and things on the web should all support http unless they really need https" crowd Supporting unencrypted connections does not imply that the client is required to use them. > What the client ought to do and what the client does do are different stories and neither are guaranteed to be what you want in the end anyways. Yes, which is why the reader should configure how they intend it to be and the document author should not prevent it from working how the reader intended.
- zamadatix 2y ago
  Supporting both is part of the problem unfortunately. In principle I agree on how the user agent should behave, in practice leaving viewport as default doesn't necessarily match what the user wants or what the developer wants. E.g. user zoom settings are still applied after the viewport scale setting, just now in a consistent way across mobile devices.

threatofrain 2y ago

https should be used just about everywhere. We should no longer be assuming that we live in a world where people won't fuck with you. If you don't have https then someone can change your website so hard... that you're basically allowing someone to use your credibility to speak to your visitors. The social engineering potential is limited only by imagination.