6 ms·

To the author: perhaps if you want this so badly you could source the machine and officially donate it to the NSA yourself and then reference the donation paper

To the author: perhaps if you want this so badly you could source the machine and officially donate it to the NSA yourself and then reference the donation paperwork in your next FOIA . I doubt trashing the NSA all over tech media will get you what you want.. plus I don’t want extra bureaucrats hired just to spend more money on obscure FOIA requests..

rocqua 2y ago
Ideally, the response isn't to hire more people to fight the FOIA requests, but instead to honor the requests.
- rlpb 2y ago
  The NSA said: "NSA is not required to find or obtain new technology (outdated or current) in order to process a request" (from https://www.muckrock.com/news/archives/2024/jul/10/grace-hopper-lost-lecture-found-nsa/ https://www.muckrock.com/news/archives/2024/jul/10/grace-hop...) That seems reasonable to me. The FOIA is about citizen oversight of government, and spending reasonable amount of taxpayer funds on doing that. This request would exceed that remit. As another commenter said, FOIA is quite rightly not an appropriate approach to demand public funds to be spent here.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - mjevans 2y ago
    I agree -HOWEVER- the government should retain the ability to transmit official records. This might include the transcription of outdated formats and technologies to new formats which are supported. It SHOULD also include release to the public domain BEFORE it becomes a burden to review the records.
    - fragmede 2y ago
      that's the library of Congress' job though, not the NSA via the FOIA's job. the LoC has the mission and resources to do exactly that.
pessimizer 2y ago
The NSA should have the ability to answer any FOIA request. Massive federal agencies shouldn't be able to plead laziness.
- subjectsigma 2y ago
  No, this is not at all how FOIA works. You cannot request copyrighted, classified, sensitive, or otherwise protected information. You cannot FOIA something that doesn’t exist and you also can’t force the government to do research on your behalf. If you consider this reasonable then I don’t think it’s a super big jump to say FOIA requests should not force the government to source expensive or hard to acquire equipment.
  - Dig1t 2y ago
    >classified, sensitive, or otherwise protected information Do you think this footage falls under any of these categories? What is to stop the agency from just saying every request is "sensitive"? Without any accountability, what is the point of the law in the first place? This behavior does not seem to be in the spirit of the FOIA act itself. This agency is _extremely_ well funded, they can afford to accommodate this request.
    - mcswell 2y ago
      > Do you think this footage falls under any of these categories? Without knowing the details surrounding the talk, it's hard to say, but given that the NSA (not the Library of Congress, or the National Archives, or DEC, or some university) owns the tape, it's quite possible. What the NSA said is that they would have to listen to it to decide whether it falls under any of those categories. I think they do that (listen, read,...) to everything they release under FOIA, precisely because they deal with classified information.
    - rurban 2y ago
      Guys, the talk is unclassified if you care to read the article. It's about the resources. They won't digitize everything for obscure FOIA requests on old tapes unless some billionaire spends it for them.
deleted 2y ago
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rocqua 2y ago

Ideally, the response isn't to hire more people to fight the FOIA requests, but instead to honor the requests.

rlpb 2y ago
The NSA said: "NSA is not required to find or obtain new technology (outdated or current) in order to process a request" (from https://www.muckrock.com/news/archives/2024/jul/10/grace-hopper-lost-lecture-found-nsa/ https://www.muckrock.com/news/archives/2024/jul/10/grace-hop...) That seems reasonable to me. The FOIA is about citizen oversight of government, and spending reasonable amount of taxpayer funds on doing that. This request would exceed that remit. As another commenter said, FOIA is quite rightly not an appropriate approach to demand public funds to be spent here.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- mjevans 2y ago
  I agree -HOWEVER- the government should retain the ability to transmit official records. This might include the transcription of outdated formats and technologies to new formats which are supported. It SHOULD also include release to the public domain BEFORE it becomes a burden to review the records.
  - fragmede 2y ago
    that's the library of Congress' job though, not the NSA via the FOIA's job. the LoC has the mission and resources to do exactly that.

pessimizer 2y ago

The NSA should have the ability to answer any FOIA request. Massive federal agencies shouldn't be able to plead laziness.

subjectsigma 2y ago
No, this is not at all how FOIA works. You cannot request copyrighted, classified, sensitive, or otherwise protected information. You cannot FOIA something that doesn’t exist and you also can’t force the government to do research on your behalf. If you consider this reasonable then I don’t think it’s a super big jump to say FOIA requests should not force the government to source expensive or hard to acquire equipment.
- Dig1t 2y ago
  >classified, sensitive, or otherwise protected information Do you think this footage falls under any of these categories? What is to stop the agency from just saying every request is "sensitive"? Without any accountability, what is the point of the law in the first place? This behavior does not seem to be in the spirit of the FOIA act itself. This agency is _extremely_ well funded, they can afford to accommodate this request.
  - mcswell 2y ago
    > Do you think this footage falls under any of these categories? Without knowing the details surrounding the talk, it's hard to say, but given that the NSA (not the Library of Congress, or the National Archives, or DEC, or some university) owns the tape, it's quite possible. What the NSA said is that they would have to listen to it to decide whether it falls under any of those categories. I think they do that (listen, read,...) to everything they release under FOIA, precisely because they deal with classified information.
  - rurban 2y ago
    Guys, the talk is unclassified if you care to read the article. It's about the resources. They won't digitize everything for obscure FOIA requests on old tapes unless some billionaire spends it for them.

deleted 2y ago

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