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The article seems to suggest that “liveness checks” are an effective counter to stolen selfies. But aren’t all those checks just running against videos? Why ca

by ketzo 2y ago

The article seems to suggest that “liveness checks” are an effective counter to stolen selfies. But aren’t all those checks just running against videos? Why can’t those videos also be stolen/mocked? All in all: yikes.

patrakov 2y ago
Speaking as GCash user: sometimes the instructions say "blink", sometimes "stay still", sometimes "look right", and it is thus not possible to predict the timing to a sufficient degree to pass it with a pre-recorded video.
- vasco 2y ago
  Nothing a little faceswap connected to the webcam feed can't fix.
  - lazide 2y ago
    Yup, but it’s an arms race. They will come next.
    - vasco 2y ago
      It's funny to extend this to the max. Prick my finger to take a blood sample into a DNA sequencer enclave within the processor of each device?
      - lazide 2y ago
        At some point I expect a physical presence at a given location is what will matter. If someone identifiable has to physically be at, say, a police station, or DMV, it cuts out 95% of the complexity involved in all the security stuff we’re dealing with. Just from an attack scalability perspective.
- idiotsecant 2y ago
  I guess the solution is to render fake video on the fly doing pose and expression emulation which is possible with a few static shots, open source tools, and a halfway decent machine. It might not fool a human, but you dontnhave too and I suspect it won't be long before fooling the average human will be pretty easy too.
jt2190 2y ago
In an AI powered world it’s just a matter of time before the liveness checks used today (take selfie video and perform actions as instructed like “turn your head to the right”) can be perfectly replicated. Supposedly the livness checks will get more complex and try to stay ahead of the AI scams. In my opinion we logically end up needing something that looks like a pre-arranged Proof of Identity (Aadhaar, Clear) or Proof of Humanity (World Coin, etc.)

by ketzo 2y ago

patrakov 2y ago

Speaking as GCash user: sometimes the instructions say "blink", sometimes "stay still", sometimes "look right", and it is thus not possible to predict the timing to a sufficient degree to pass it with a pre-recorded video.

vasco 2y ago
Nothing a little faceswap connected to the webcam feed can't fix.
- lazide 2y ago
  Yup, but it’s an arms race. They will come next.
  - vasco 2y ago
    It's funny to extend this to the max. Prick my finger to take a blood sample into a DNA sequencer enclave within the processor of each device?
    - lazide 2y ago
      At some point I expect a physical presence at a given location is what will matter. If someone identifiable has to physically be at, say, a police station, or DMV, it cuts out 95% of the complexity involved in all the security stuff we’re dealing with. Just from an attack scalability perspective.
idiotsecant 2y ago
I guess the solution is to render fake video on the fly doing pose and expression emulation which is possible with a few static shots, open source tools, and a halfway decent machine. It might not fool a human, but you dontnhave too and I suspect it won't be long before fooling the average human will be pretty easy too.

jt2190 2y ago

In an AI powered world it’s just a matter of time before the liveness checks used today (take selfie video and perform actions as instructed like “turn your head to the right”) can be perfectly replicated. Supposedly the livness checks will get more complex and try to stay ahead of the AI scams. In my opinion we logically end up needing something that looks like a pre-arranged Proof of Identity (Aadhaar, Clear) or Proof of Humanity (World Coin, etc.)