4 ms·

> On top of that you have access to "Project 2025" clearly on the internet, you can read exactly what's the plan for a next Trump government and you are still s

> On top of that you have access to "Project 2025" clearly on the internet, you can read exactly what's the plan for a next Trump government and you are still siding on that. That's just a wishlist by a coalition of conservative thinktanks. Trump didn't personally write it, and when he claims he hasn't even read it, I believe him–why would he want to read 922 pages of thinktank verbiage? [0] Obama probably would (as a former constitutional law professor I'm sure he can demolish a thousand pages of blather for breakfast), I doubt Trump's attention span is long enough If Trump wins in November, they'll spoon feed him this document in bite-sized chunks. And he might actually agree to implement some of it. But I'm sure other bits he'll either reject, or only agree to in some watered-down form. Because he doesn't personally agree with it. Or because he worries about negative political blowback (e.g. the 2026 mid-terms). Or because competing lobbyists/advisors/etc are urging him to do something else instead. And I reckon if you went looking, you'd find instances of progressive groups publishing "wishlists" or "advice" for potential future Democratic administrations too. No doubt Biden/Obama/Clinton did some of their asks, and failed or refused to do others – just like what's going to happen here, assuming Trump wins (which right now looks more likely than not, but it isn't impossible the Democrats might recover, especially if they swap Biden for someone else) [0] https://static.project2025.org/2025_MandateForLeadership_FULL.pdf https://static.project2025.org/2025_MandateForLeadership_FUL...

piva00 2y ago
> If Trump wins in November, they'll spoon feed him this document in bite-sized chunks. And he might actually agree to implement some of it. But I'm sure other bits he'll either reject, or only agree to in some watered-down form. And isn't this already scary enough to reject a Trump presidency? That's what I mean about the Overton window shifting, when some parts of that tome are acceptable as public policy given the foundation of the whole document... It shouldn't be acceptable that any of it would be considered as policy, even less by a stupid ignorant like Trump who won't even read it, much less have any semblance of knowledge for the consequences of applying those policies. The guy openly states his ignorance and stupidity, and his voters accept that ignorance as a good trait, it's absolutely unfathomable.
- skissane 2y ago
  > And isn't this already scary enough to reject a Trump presidency? I'm an outside observer sitting on the other side of the planet looking in. So I'm not personally accepting or rejecting anything. But I note Trump said a lot of rather frightening stuff in his 2016 campaign–a fair chunk of which he rather quickly walked back on once he walked into the White House. And I'm pretty sure the same thing is going to happen this time around. He sold voters this massive wall on the southern border, he only ever built bits of it – and the random border fencing improvements he did do aren't fundamentally different from what his predecessor or successor have done. He promised a "Muslim ban" – which if he'd actually done it would have been a rather horrific policy – but it morphed into restrictions on citizens from certain countries, and major Muslim states such as Saudi Arabia were off the list, while North Korea (where people debate to what extent Islam even exists, outside of embassy staff and expats) was on it. He was never going to ban his Saudi pals, and I've even heard they knew that all along. In fact, he's already walking back on some stuff and he hasn't even won yet – e.g. earlier this year he talked very loudly about ending aid to Ukraine, and then suddenly he switched gears and stayed quiet while Congressional Republicans passed a Ukraine aid bill. [0] Nobody knows what Trump is going to do – including Trump himself – but he's unlikely to actually meet the demands of the most rabid members of the GOP base. He just wants them to think he will. And when he eventually betrays them, they just have to shut up and take it - they might whine a bit, but will anyone be listening? What other choice do they have? [1] And I expect some Americans who are going to vote for Trump, are viewing it as a gamble – he sounded scary in 2016, yet (at least for them personally) he wasn't actually that bad, so vote for him with the hope the same thing happens this time around. And you'll be warning "this time around is different". And maybe you are right and they'll lose big. Then again, maybe they are right, and they won't. Nobody really knows what the future holds. [0] https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/was-the-ukraine-aid-bill-a-trump-defeat-or-planned-retreat.html https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/was-the-ukraine-aid-... [1] https://www.politico.com/news/2024/07/08/trump-platform-gop-abortion-00166912 https://www.politico.com/news/2024/07/08/trump-platform-gop-...
  - AnimalMuppet 2y ago
    But isn't that just as disqualifying? If you vote for a normal politician, they have a platform, and that platform is a declaration of intent. (At least to some degree - I know, politicians lie for votes.) With Trump, he lies so much and so casually and so blatantly, you have no idea what his policies will be. None. There is zero correlation with what he says. That's not something I'm willing to sign up for. I want at least some idea of what his policies will actually be.

piva00 2y ago

> If Trump wins in November, they'll spoon feed him this document in bite-sized chunks. And he might actually agree to implement some of it. But I'm sure other bits he'll either reject, or only agree to in some watered-down form. And isn't this already scary enough to reject a Trump presidency? That's what I mean about the Overton window shifting, when some parts of that tome are acceptable as public policy given the foundation of the whole document... It shouldn't be acceptable that any of it would be considered as policy, even less by a stupid ignorant like Trump who won't even read it, much less have any semblance of knowledge for the consequences of applying those policies. The guy openly states his ignorance and stupidity, and his voters accept that ignorance as a good trait, it's absolutely unfathomable.

skissane 2y ago
> And isn't this already scary enough to reject a Trump presidency? I'm an outside observer sitting on the other side of the planet looking in. So I'm not personally accepting or rejecting anything. But I note Trump said a lot of rather frightening stuff in his 2016 campaign–a fair chunk of which he rather quickly walked back on once he walked into the White House. And I'm pretty sure the same thing is going to happen this time around. He sold voters this massive wall on the southern border, he only ever built bits of it – and the random border fencing improvements he did do aren't fundamentally different from what his predecessor or successor have done. He promised a "Muslim ban" – which if he'd actually done it would have been a rather horrific policy – but it morphed into restrictions on citizens from certain countries, and major Muslim states such as Saudi Arabia were off the list, while North Korea (where people debate to what extent Islam even exists, outside of embassy staff and expats) was on it. He was never going to ban his Saudi pals, and I've even heard they knew that all along. In fact, he's already walking back on some stuff and he hasn't even won yet – e.g. earlier this year he talked very loudly about ending aid to Ukraine, and then suddenly he switched gears and stayed quiet while Congressional Republicans passed a Ukraine aid bill. [0] Nobody knows what Trump is going to do – including Trump himself – but he's unlikely to actually meet the demands of the most rabid members of the GOP base. He just wants them to think he will. And when he eventually betrays them, they just have to shut up and take it - they might whine a bit, but will anyone be listening? What other choice do they have? [1] And I expect some Americans who are going to vote for Trump, are viewing it as a gamble – he sounded scary in 2016, yet (at least for them personally) he wasn't actually that bad, so vote for him with the hope the same thing happens this time around. And you'll be warning "this time around is different". And maybe you are right and they'll lose big. Then again, maybe they are right, and they won't. Nobody really knows what the future holds. [0] https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/was-the-ukraine-aid-bill-a-trump-defeat-or-planned-retreat.html https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/was-the-ukraine-aid-... [1] https://www.politico.com/news/2024/07/08/trump-platform-gop-abortion-00166912 https://www.politico.com/news/2024/07/08/trump-platform-gop-...
- AnimalMuppet 2y ago
  But isn't that just as disqualifying? If you vote for a normal politician, they have a platform, and that platform is a declaration of intent. (At least to some degree - I know, politicians lie for votes.) With Trump, he lies so much and so casually and so blatantly, you have no idea what his policies will be. None. There is zero correlation with what he says. That's not something I'm willing to sign up for. I want at least some idea of what his policies will actually be.