3 ms·

Employment are an adversarial relationship of convenience Given the chance, both parties would expect the other party be loyal while they optimize for somethin

Employment are an adversarial relationship of convenience Given the chance, both parties would expect the other party be loyal while they optimize for something better than what they have.

Culonavirus 2y ago
Yea doesn't sound dysfunctional at all... lol. Apply that for marriage for example: > Given the chance, both parties would expect the other party be loyal while they optimize for something better than what they have. Peachy.
- rkachowski 2y ago
  The difference between employment relationships and marriage is rather large.
  - silverquiet 2y ago
    The divorce rate would suggest it isn't that large.
    - nkrisc 2y ago
      Historically, marriages often were almost transactional arrangements of convenience.
      - silverquiet 2y ago
        I'd say that also reflects my experience with dating.
  - ajot 2y ago
    You should be looking at employment as a contract, and marriage (and other personal relationships) as a covenant. If you apply tit-for-tat with your spouse, at least one of you will end dissatisfied and hurt.
- _w1tm 2y ago
  Who would want to be married with their company? You are finding dysfunction where there is none. Imagine expecting the employee or company to have the other party for better or for worse, till death do them apart. Talk about dysfunction!
  - Culonavirus 2y ago
    But I am talking about loyalty. Marriage was just an example that points out the absurd nature of the "loyalty" the user described. You can't say "well, I am loyal as long as I don't have any other options"... that's not how loyalty works.
- kombookcha 2y ago
  Damn that's crazy, almost like they're completely different and applying the features of one to the other is apples and oranges. ;)
galdosdi 2y ago
No, not at all. You have missed the mark completely here. This is totally culturally dependent. In a culture where this is expected, this is indeed what will happen. If you've only ever lived in such a culture then, yeah, you might get the mistaken idea this is an intrinsic human universal truth. But cultural norms are really powerful and can absolutely overcome natural game theory / self interest dynamics. If everyone you know would think less of you after you quit a job when it is known that employers are loyal, you won't do it. Same goes for the reverse.
JohnFen 2y ago
An employment arrangement is a business deal, nothing more and nothing less. Whether or not it's adversarial depends on the nature of the deal and the entities involved. The most common error I see in employment is the employees not understanding this basic truth. That leads to situations such as people thinking that an employer is doing them a favor in some way by hiring them, which leads to people giving up some of their power. The most common way people give up their power is by thinking they don't have any.

Employment are an adversarial relationship of convenience Given the chance, both parties would expect the other party be loyal while they optimize for something better than what they have.

Culonavirus 2y ago

Yea doesn't sound dysfunctional at all... lol. Apply that for marriage for example: > Given the chance, both parties would expect the other party be loyal while they optimize for something better than what they have. Peachy.

rkachowski 2y ago
The difference between employment relationships and marriage is rather large.
- silverquiet 2y ago
  The divorce rate would suggest it isn't that large.
  - nkrisc 2y ago
    Historically, marriages often were almost transactional arrangements of convenience.
    - silverquiet 2y ago
      I'd say that also reflects my experience with dating.
- ajot 2y ago
  You should be looking at employment as a contract, and marriage (and other personal relationships) as a covenant. If you apply tit-for-tat with your spouse, at least one of you will end dissatisfied and hurt.
_w1tm 2y ago
Who would want to be married with their company? You are finding dysfunction where there is none. Imagine expecting the employee or company to have the other party for better or for worse, till death do them apart. Talk about dysfunction!
- Culonavirus 2y ago
  But I am talking about loyalty. Marriage was just an example that points out the absurd nature of the "loyalty" the user described. You can't say "well, I am loyal as long as I don't have any other options"... that's not how loyalty works.
kombookcha 2y ago
Damn that's crazy, almost like they're completely different and applying the features of one to the other is apples and oranges. ;)

galdosdi 2y ago

No, not at all. You have missed the mark completely here. This is totally culturally dependent. In a culture where this is expected, this is indeed what will happen. If you've only ever lived in such a culture then, yeah, you might get the mistaken idea this is an intrinsic human universal truth. But cultural norms are really powerful and can absolutely overcome natural game theory / self interest dynamics. If everyone you know would think less of you after you quit a job when it is known that employers are loyal, you won't do it. Same goes for the reverse.

JohnFen 2y ago

An employment arrangement is a business deal, nothing more and nothing less. Whether or not it's adversarial depends on the nature of the deal and the entities involved. The most common error I see in employment is the employees not understanding this basic truth. That leads to situations such as people thinking that an employer is doing them a favor in some way by hiring them, which leads to people giving up some of their power. The most common way people give up their power is by thinking they don't have any.