4 ms·

“Cultural Marxism” is just another in a long line of terms like “Islamofascism” and “National Socialism” that exist solely to allow capitalists and fascists to

“Cultural Marxism” is just another in a long line of terms like “Islamofascism” and “National Socialism” that exist solely to allow capitalists and fascists to propagandize to the most ignorant kind of authoritarian. These terms are made by those who want to weaponize the political right (AKA, the political wrong) against the political right’s own collective self-interest, specifically to keep them from growing up and actually understanding (rather than simply reflexively reacting to) the ideas of the political center and the political left. The political right is the only audience for this propaganda, it’s only purpose for the political center and the political left is to distract and divide them in frivolous debate. The mindset (really more of an inbuilt cognitive bias) you’re looking for is authoritarianism.

trimethylpurine 2y ago
I think you may be overly generalizing. Without doubt certain governments, especially in the Islamic parts of the world, are fascist. It's a paradox that anti fascists in the West support governments that oppress women, and gays, and hang dissenters. Is your point that this shouldn't be called Islamofascism? I've never heard that term before, but I'm doubtlessly not ignorant to the fact that these governments gained their foothold through literal implementations of Islam coupled with Western weaponry. That combination does seem to define a parallel between Islam and fascism for those specific cases so I don't think that term is necessarily misplaced. Again only in those cases. I could make similar points about the other terms you've listed. That the terms exist may simply be a manifestation of the fact that there are clear examples of them. Whether you choose to apply them more broadly to the extent they are misplaced, I think, is left to interpretation, especially your own.
- yawpitch 2y ago
  “Islamofascism” is a neologism popularized by George Bush Jr (aka Little Bush) and Co, and it was never aimed at Islamic states, but explicitly for non-state actors like Al Quaeda. IIRC Bush (and at the same time Cheney) started running with it while also being extremely cozy with those Islamic states you might be inaccurately associating with a very loose definition of fascism (it’s accurate to describe those states as authoritarian theocracies, but fascism is a specific authoritarian political program in which the state is the religion, not one in which the religion is the state). Loosening the meaning of the word fascist to move it away from racialist and nationalist corporatist authoritarianism (see America under Little Bush and Big Trump, and definitely the America sought by the religious wrong) was a large part of why that term was popularized, they wanted everyone distracted from their use of Mussolini’s playbook.
  - trimethylpurine 2y ago
    >fascism is a specific authoritarian political program in which the state is the religion, not one in which the religion is the state In that case then neither can the American left call the right fascist. By definition, you just said, the moment they are church affiliated they cease to be fascists. Isn't that right? And if that's true then we can say the left's agenda in calling the right fascists looks strikingly similar to the one you attributed solely to the right. It's just a bunch of confusing terms misattributed to a political group, just like "Islamofascism" isn't it? Or maybe, and this is what I think, the definitions are all just messy tools bent to fit whatever blunt use justifies whichever party you so happen to identify with. Sort of like choosing the Bulls or the Clippers. And the center is when you realize that.
    - yawpitch 2y ago
      > In that case then neither can the American left call the right fascist. Both sides call each other fascist, usually by misapplying the term. That said, the political program of today’s American right is much closer in alignment to historical fascism (and includes some self-avowed fascists) than the American left. Which makes sense, historical fascism was always a right-wing and conservative political program. > By definition, you just said, the moment they are church affiliated they cease to be fascists. Isn't that right? Well no, religiosity doesn’t make you fascist, and fascism doesn’t make you areligious… there’s a big leap between church-affiliated and totalitarian theocracy. Though, again, the American right is a lot closer to wanting to establish a totalitarian theocracy than the American left. > And if that's true then we can say the left's agenda in calling the right fascists looks strikingly similar to the one you attributed solely to the right. Well, no… if the American left were calling the American right something like “Christofascists”, then maybe. And I didn’t say that crafting propagandistic neologisms was exclusively a tool of the right, it’s just one the right is really prone to using precisely because those neologisms appeal to the more authoritarian elements of their base. And, yet again, the American right is way more aligned with authoritarianism than the American left, which is what makes the left’s own ignorant base more prone to discord than all joining in a chant of worship to their orange god-king. Precisely the point of this kind of propaganda, really. The real center is when you realize what direction the Overton Window is from you. If it’s too your right, then the odds are you’re yesterday’s centrist and today’s communist. In today’s America the Overton Window is extremely far to the right.

trimethylpurine 2y ago

I think you may be overly generalizing. Without doubt certain governments, especially in the Islamic parts of the world, are fascist. It's a paradox that anti fascists in the West support governments that oppress women, and gays, and hang dissenters. Is your point that this shouldn't be called Islamofascism? I've never heard that term before, but I'm doubtlessly not ignorant to the fact that these governments gained their foothold through literal implementations of Islam coupled with Western weaponry. That combination does seem to define a parallel between Islam and fascism for those specific cases so I don't think that term is necessarily misplaced. Again only in those cases. I could make similar points about the other terms you've listed. That the terms exist may simply be a manifestation of the fact that there are clear examples of them. Whether you choose to apply them more broadly to the extent they are misplaced, I think, is left to interpretation, especially your own.

yawpitch 2y ago
“Islamofascism” is a neologism popularized by George Bush Jr (aka Little Bush) and Co, and it was never aimed at Islamic states, but explicitly for non-state actors like Al Quaeda. IIRC Bush (and at the same time Cheney) started running with it while also being extremely cozy with those Islamic states you might be inaccurately associating with a very loose definition of fascism (it’s accurate to describe those states as authoritarian theocracies, but fascism is a specific authoritarian political program in which the state is the religion, not one in which the religion is the state). Loosening the meaning of the word fascist to move it away from racialist and nationalist corporatist authoritarianism (see America under Little Bush and Big Trump, and definitely the America sought by the religious wrong) was a large part of why that term was popularized, they wanted everyone distracted from their use of Mussolini’s playbook.
- trimethylpurine 2y ago
  >fascism is a specific authoritarian political program in which the state is the religion, not one in which the religion is the state In that case then neither can the American left call the right fascist. By definition, you just said, the moment they are church affiliated they cease to be fascists. Isn't that right? And if that's true then we can say the left's agenda in calling the right fascists looks strikingly similar to the one you attributed solely to the right. It's just a bunch of confusing terms misattributed to a political group, just like "Islamofascism" isn't it? Or maybe, and this is what I think, the definitions are all just messy tools bent to fit whatever blunt use justifies whichever party you so happen to identify with. Sort of like choosing the Bulls or the Clippers. And the center is when you realize that.
  - yawpitch 2y ago
    > In that case then neither can the American left call the right fascist. Both sides call each other fascist, usually by misapplying the term. That said, the political program of today’s American right is much closer in alignment to historical fascism (and includes some self-avowed fascists) than the American left. Which makes sense, historical fascism was always a right-wing and conservative political program. > By definition, you just said, the moment they are church affiliated they cease to be fascists. Isn't that right? Well no, religiosity doesn’t make you fascist, and fascism doesn’t make you areligious… there’s a big leap between church-affiliated and totalitarian theocracy. Though, again, the American right is a lot closer to wanting to establish a totalitarian theocracy than the American left. > And if that's true then we can say the left's agenda in calling the right fascists looks strikingly similar to the one you attributed solely to the right. Well, no… if the American left were calling the American right something like “Christofascists”, then maybe. And I didn’t say that crafting propagandistic neologisms was exclusively a tool of the right, it’s just one the right is really prone to using precisely because those neologisms appeal to the more authoritarian elements of their base. And, yet again, the American right is way more aligned with authoritarianism than the American left, which is what makes the left’s own ignorant base more prone to discord than all joining in a chant of worship to their orange god-king. Precisely the point of this kind of propaganda, really. The real center is when you realize what direction the Overton Window is from you. If it’s too your right, then the odds are you’re yesterday’s centrist and today’s communist. In today’s America the Overton Window is extremely far to the right.