3 ms·

> I don’t understand where this idea that Apple has lost most of their chip design talent and is in trouble rhetoric is coming from. Why are you saying this?

> I don’t understand where this idea that Apple has lost most of their chip design talent and is in trouble rhetoric is coming from. Why are you saying this? The article doesn't seem to imply that? Apple isn't in any kind of trouble. But the gap between Apple and the competition does appear to be closing. Right now Apple's biggest advantage is they buy up all of TSMC supply for the latest node. They're always a little faster because they're always a node ahead. Qualcomm Snapdragon X Elite is reasonably impressive from a CPU and x86 emulation perspective. The GPU hardware seems kinda sorta ok. But their GPU drivers are dog poop. Which is why they suck for Windows gaming. I hope AMD and Nvidia start to release ARM SoC designs for laptops/desktops next year. That could get interesting fast. All hail competition!

hajile 2y ago
The first 4 minute mile was revolutionary. It’s not ordinary today, but isn’t super surprising either. Apple bet big that we hasn’t hit the limits of how wide a machine can go. They created ARM64 to push this idea as it tries to eliminate things that make this hard. Everyone wrote off iPhone performance as mobile only and not really representative of performance on a “real” computer. M1 changed that and set the clock ticking. Once everyone realized it was possible, they needed to adjust future plans and start work on their own copy (with companies like Nuvia having a head start in accepting the new way of things due to leadership who believed in M1 performance). In the next few years, very wide machines will just be the way things are done and while they won’t be hyper common, they won’t be surprising either.
Wytwwww 2y ago
> I hope AMD and Nvidia start to release ARM SoC designs for laptops/desktops next year Or AMD / Intel could just make more power efficient x86 core? What would they gain by switching to ARM? Also developing a competitive ARM core in less than a year is pretty much impossible, it took Qualcomm several years to catch up with ARMs cores (hence the title...). They even had to buy another company to accomplish that.
- forrestthewoods 2y ago
  > Or AMD / Intel could just make more power efficient x86 core? What would they gain by switching to ARM? I mixed some thoughts in rewrites. I hope Nvidia releases laptop/desktop SoC. AMD is getting better at x86 mobile, Steamdeck is pretty decent. I hope they keep getting better. I'd like to see high-end integrated GPU on a SoC from AMD for laptops/desktops. That doesn't exist yet. It requires a discrete GPU and there's a kajillion issues that stem from having two GPU paths. Just give me one SoC with shared memory and a competitive GPU. I don't care if it's ARM or x86. > Also developing a competitive ARM core in less than a year is pretty much impossible What makes you think they'd just be starting? Nvidia has been shipping ARM cores for years. Nintendo Switch is an Nvidia Tegra. Here's an article from October 2023 claiming that Nvidia is working on CPUs for Windows to ship in 2025. Qualcomm has an "ARM for Windows" exclusive that expires at some point in 2024. https://www.reuters.com/technology/nvidia-make-arm-based-pc-chips-major-new-challenge-intel-2023-10-23/ https://www.reuters.com/technology/nvidia-make-arm-based-pc-...
  - ksec 2y ago
    There is a different between design and developing a CPU Core like Oryon Core here, and Nvidia shipping ARM SoC which the CPU design itself that is from ARM, likely Cortex-X5.
    - forrestthewoods 2y ago
      I don’t care who designs the CPU. I just would love to see a Nvidia SoC that targets laptops and desktops that has a high end GPU built in. Does that require them to design a custom CPU and not use an ARM design? I don’t know. I also don’t really care. Either way is fine!
    - kcb 2y ago
      Nvidia has a long history of design and developing their own CPU cores.
      - Wytwwww 2y ago

hajile 2y ago

The first 4 minute mile was revolutionary. It’s not ordinary today, but isn’t super surprising either. Apple bet big that we hasn’t hit the limits of how wide a machine can go. They created ARM64 to push this idea as it tries to eliminate things that make this hard. Everyone wrote off iPhone performance as mobile only and not really representative of performance on a “real” computer. M1 changed that and set the clock ticking. Once everyone realized it was possible, they needed to adjust future plans and start work on their own copy (with companies like Nuvia having a head start in accepting the new way of things due to leadership who believed in M1 performance). In the next few years, very wide machines will just be the way things are done and while they won’t be hyper common, they won’t be surprising either.

Wytwwww 2y ago

> I hope AMD and Nvidia start to release ARM SoC designs for laptops/desktops next year Or AMD / Intel could just make more power efficient x86 core? What would they gain by switching to ARM? Also developing a competitive ARM core in less than a year is pretty much impossible, it took Qualcomm several years to catch up with ARMs cores (hence the title...). They even had to buy another company to accomplish that.

forrestthewoods 2y ago
> Or AMD / Intel could just make more power efficient x86 core? What would they gain by switching to ARM? I mixed some thoughts in rewrites. I hope Nvidia releases laptop/desktop SoC. AMD is getting better at x86 mobile, Steamdeck is pretty decent. I hope they keep getting better. I'd like to see high-end integrated GPU on a SoC from AMD for laptops/desktops. That doesn't exist yet. It requires a discrete GPU and there's a kajillion issues that stem from having two GPU paths. Just give me one SoC with shared memory and a competitive GPU. I don't care if it's ARM or x86. > Also developing a competitive ARM core in less than a year is pretty much impossible What makes you think they'd just be starting? Nvidia has been shipping ARM cores for years. Nintendo Switch is an Nvidia Tegra. Here's an article from October 2023 claiming that Nvidia is working on CPUs for Windows to ship in 2025. Qualcomm has an "ARM for Windows" exclusive that expires at some point in 2024. https://www.reuters.com/technology/nvidia-make-arm-based-pc-chips-major-new-challenge-intel-2023-10-23/ https://www.reuters.com/technology/nvidia-make-arm-based-pc-...
- ksec 2y ago
  There is a different between design and developing a CPU Core like Oryon Core here, and Nvidia shipping ARM SoC which the CPU design itself that is from ARM, likely Cortex-X5.
  - forrestthewoods 2y ago
    I don’t care who designs the CPU. I just would love to see a Nvidia SoC that targets laptops and desktops that has a high end GPU built in. Does that require them to design a custom CPU and not use an ARM design? I don’t know. I also don’t really care. Either way is fine!
  - kcb 2y ago
    Nvidia has a long history of design and developing their own CPU cores.
    - Wytwwww 2y ago