4 ms·

What are the politics of "starry night"?

afiori 2y ago
I have no idea, nor do I necessarily think that they exists. An hypothrtical person holding the opinion I described might try to point out some effect the artwork had on the world as a political effect, I for sure do not know enough about art and/or history to speculate. In this view authorial intent has a second-class position to its tangible effect.
- woooooo 2y ago
  I'm with you on death of the author.
  - afiori 2y ago
    I actually do not like the emphasis on death of the author that much[0], I appreciate the relativism of saying that authorial intent is not the only allowed interpretation, yet it is still a very important one. [0] Also I feel the need to reiterate that I was expressing the possible opinions of a hypothetical person I made up, not my own.
aorist 2y ago
Too easy: Van Gogh painted it in an asylum (social safety net) run by Franciscans (repeal of anti-Church laws during the Third Republic) because he had self-admitted after cutting off his own ear (treatment of physical violence as a medical problem) because he owed money to Gaugin (private property). It includes an imaginary house and was painted from memory because he wasn't allowed to paint in his room (medical treatment in a total institution), but he was allowed to use a spare room in the half-full asylum which was normally for the wealthy (obvious). That said, he considered it a painting from nature, rather than an "abstraction", a form which was preferred by Gaugin in order to indicate harmony between man and nature (a fin de siècle concern which also directly lead to the rejections of liberal democracy and bourgeois society in the early 20th Century). On his own account, the subject matter of stars connotes a spiritual hope — and you can make what you will of the more specific religous and astronomical interpratations that came later. In a narrow sense, there's no political art except electoral propaganda, in a broad sense anything made by humans is political. So I don't find the game of definitions is not particularly interesting. It's not even that interesting whether the political content of art is intentional or self-concious on the part of the author or whether it's imposed by others. The process which I think is worth thinking about is the very second-order process we're engaging in now: who wants to make a claim about the politics (or lack thereof) of art, and why are they interested in doing that?
- woooooo 2y ago
  The only thing you've got relating to the actual art is "it has stars"?
  - voltaireodactyl 2y ago
    There are many paintings of stars and sky. Why is this one the archetype? Is it because they are the best painted stars?
  - afiori 2y ago
    Because part of the disagreement is also whether the surrounding context (both conterporary and present) is part of the artwork

I have no idea, nor do I necessarily think that they exists. An hypothrtical person holding the opinion I described might try to point out some effect the artwork had on the world as a political effect, I for sure do not know enough about art and/or history to speculate. In this view authorial intent has a second-class position to its tangible effect.

woooooo 2y ago
I'm with you on death of the author.
- afiori 2y ago
  I actually do not like the emphasis on death of the author that much[0], I appreciate the relativism of saying that authorial intent is not the only allowed interpretation, yet it is still a very important one. [0] Also I feel the need to reiterate that I was expressing the possible opinions of a hypothetical person I made up, not my own.

aorist 2y ago

Too easy: Van Gogh painted it in an asylum (social safety net) run by Franciscans (repeal of anti-Church laws during the Third Republic) because he had self-admitted after cutting off his own ear (treatment of physical violence as a medical problem) because he owed money to Gaugin (private property). It includes an imaginary house and was painted from memory because he wasn't allowed to paint in his room (medical treatment in a total institution), but he was allowed to use a spare room in the half-full asylum which was normally for the wealthy (obvious). That said, he considered it a painting from nature, rather than an "abstraction", a form which was preferred by Gaugin in order to indicate harmony between man and nature (a fin de siècle concern which also directly lead to the rejections of liberal democracy and bourgeois society in the early 20th Century). On his own account, the subject matter of stars connotes a spiritual hope — and you can make what you will of the more specific religous and astronomical interpratations that came later. In a narrow sense, there's no political art except electoral propaganda, in a broad sense anything made by humans is political. So I don't find the game of definitions is not particularly interesting. It's not even that interesting whether the political content of art is intentional or self-concious on the part of the author or whether it's imposed by others. The process which I think is worth thinking about is the very second-order process we're engaging in now: who wants to make a claim about the politics (or lack thereof) of art, and why are they interested in doing that?

woooooo 2y ago
The only thing you've got relating to the actual art is "it has stars"?
- voltaireodactyl 2y ago
  There are many paintings of stars and sky. Why is this one the archetype? Is it because they are the best painted stars?
- afiori 2y ago
  Because part of the disagreement is also whether the surrounding context (both conterporary and present) is part of the artwork