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Apparently you missed my point. Most religious organizations have elements of corruption, sure, but Scientology as an organization is built to exploit its membe

Apparently you missed my point. Most religious organizations have elements of corruption, sure, but Scientology as an organization is built to exploit its members by design.

uptown 14y ago
I got your point. But again ... it depends what you believe. For argument's sake, let's assume there's no such thing as God -- then the entire basis for every religion is fraudulent and perpetuates falsehoods resulting in the manipulation of a community of people to think, act, tithe, and multiply according to the rules of that church. If all faiths happen to be incorrect, then aren't they guilty of the same sin ... perpetuating a fictional promise and manipulating a community (whether they know they're doing it or not) in an exploitive way? Or is it less bad because there's potentially a perceived positive effect on the individuals and the community? Look, I realize debating religion online is pretty futile, and I'm no fan of Scientology or any other religion for that matter. I do get what your saying. I also have no idea what your religious views are ... but I've had a ton of debates where people seem to be blinded by how they were brought up and can only see outward from the religious views they hold as the truth. I suppose somebody could probably make that same case for my perspective on things. Personally, I think religion is introduced way before most people have the mental capacity to comprehend what's being thrust upon them, and I wonder what the religious landscape would look like if it were the kind of thing people first-experienced later on in life.
- brey 14y ago
  > For argument's sake, let's assume there's no such thing as God -- then the entire basis for every religion is fraudulent but it's not -knowingly- fraudulent, which is the major test for culpability.
  - harshreality 14y ago
    Leaders of pentacostal/evangelical churches, perhaps? Are they knowingly fraudulent? There's no way to tell if most religious leaders truly believe, unless you catch one in an incontrovertible statement of disbelief. Even someone like the Pope could be going along with it for the prestige, or simply not knowing what he'd do with his life outside of the Church. From a non-religious perspective, either someone is brainwashed, or they are fraudulent. That distinction matters in law, but it doesn't have any bearing on the value of the religious institution.

Apparently you missed my point. Most religious organizations have elements of corruption, sure, but Scientology as an organization is built to exploit its members by design.

uptown 14y ago

I got your point. But again ... it depends what you believe. For argument's sake, let's assume there's no such thing as God -- then the entire basis for every religion is fraudulent and perpetuates falsehoods resulting in the manipulation of a community of people to think, act, tithe, and multiply according to the rules of that church. If all faiths happen to be incorrect, then aren't they guilty of the same sin ... perpetuating a fictional promise and manipulating a community (whether they know they're doing it or not) in an exploitive way? Or is it less bad because there's potentially a perceived positive effect on the individuals and the community? Look, I realize debating religion online is pretty futile, and I'm no fan of Scientology or any other religion for that matter. I do get what your saying. I also have no idea what your religious views are ... but I've had a ton of debates where people seem to be blinded by how they were brought up and can only see outward from the religious views they hold as the truth. I suppose somebody could probably make that same case for my perspective on things. Personally, I think religion is introduced way before most people have the mental capacity to comprehend what's being thrust upon them, and I wonder what the religious landscape would look like if it were the kind of thing people first-experienced later on in life.

brey 14y ago
> For argument's sake, let's assume there's no such thing as God -- then the entire basis for every religion is fraudulent but it's not -knowingly- fraudulent, which is the major test for culpability.
- harshreality 14y ago
  Leaders of pentacostal/evangelical churches, perhaps? Are they knowingly fraudulent? There's no way to tell if most religious leaders truly believe, unless you catch one in an incontrovertible statement of disbelief. Even someone like the Pope could be going along with it for the prestige, or simply not knowing what he'd do with his life outside of the Church. From a non-religious perspective, either someone is brainwashed, or they are fraudulent. That distinction matters in law, but it doesn't have any bearing on the value of the religious institution.