3 ms·

A few years ago, a friend of mine taught creative writing and literature at a state college. Her class was one of the requirements for the criminal justice prog

A few years ago, a friend of mine taught creative writing and literature at a state college. Her class was one of the requirements for the criminal justice program. Just by observing the students, she could tell which ones were in criminal justice. Her observation was that the criminal justice students were, at best, bullies and had no respect for fellow students or teachers. You're right. We don't have to have cops go through the same rigorous training as surgeons, but at least we should make sure that they are not sociopaths and have empathy and compassion for other beings (the cops, not the surgeons).

shiroiushi 2y ago
There's another problem though: if you only allow compassionate, empathic people to be police, you won't have any police in America. Those kinds of people don't want to be police, especially in a country with so much gun violence and much of the population armed and apparently having sporadic mental problems and where violence is such a normal part of daily life. It takes a "special" kind of person to want to be a cop in that kind of environment. It's very different in peaceful, gun-free countries.
- wakawaka28 2y ago
  >It's very different in peaceful, gun-free countries. You think gun-free countries have no criminals or violence? They certainly do, and it is often far more brutal because individuals cannot defend themselves from groups and knives are everywhere.
  - shiroiushi 2y ago
    Spoken like an American who's never left his country, or even flown on an airplane. I live in a gun-free country, and it's quite peaceful, completely unlike America with all its mass shootings.
    - wakawaka28 2y ago
      You've probably never been to America or shot a gun. I have been abroad to some of the most gun-free places in the world and I'm quite pleased with how we live in the US. There aren't as many shootings as the media would have you believe. The people at the top who cry about guns really just want you to be a helpless sheep. They have an imperative which is to maintain power, even if it costs you your life.
      - insane_dreamer 2y ago
        > There aren't as many shootings as the media would have you believe Regardless of the media (and I agree TV news amplify all this stuff which is why we don't even have TV in our house), the statistics (not generated by the media) show much, much higher rates of homocide, both by individuals and police officers, in the US than any other industrialized country. Regardless of you how you personally feel, the US is inherently statistically unsafe compared to other industrialized nations, especially wealthier ones like Japan, Switzerland, the Nordic countries, etc.
        wakawaka28 2y ago
        >Regardless of you how you personally feel, the US is inherently statistically unsafe compared to other industrialized nations, especially wealthier ones like Japan, Switzerland, the Nordic countries, etc. That may be but I don't think homicide is common in the US, even if it is more frequent than elsewhere. 5 in 100k is not common. I don't believe guns are to blame. I also think there are other cultural factors in play as the US is very culturally diverse compared to Nordic countries or Japan. I would be interested to know the number and severity of drug addictions per capita before considering that. Even reducing my risk of homicide from 5 in 100k to zero would not change my mind about guns. We need them to defend against all aggressors, even government actors. The police do not have a duty to protect you in the US, and even if they did they cannot be everywhere. People are quick to ridicule the idea that guns can protect you against the government these days but the logic is totally sound and has been proven again and again throughout history.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
insane_dreamer 2y ago
> we should make sure that they are not sociopaths and have empathy and compassion for other beings (the cops, not the surgeons) Exactly. And to be clear. I wasn't suggesting that cops go through the equivalent of 10 years of college + medical school. But now they get, what, 2-4 months training, in some cases just straight out of high school? But even more important is the screening -- and that's a lot of what those years of the medical school process does.

shiroiushi 2y ago

There's another problem though: if you only allow compassionate, empathic people to be police, you won't have any police in America. Those kinds of people don't want to be police, especially in a country with so much gun violence and much of the population armed and apparently having sporadic mental problems and where violence is such a normal part of daily life. It takes a "special" kind of person to want to be a cop in that kind of environment. It's very different in peaceful, gun-free countries.

wakawaka28 2y ago
>It's very different in peaceful, gun-free countries. You think gun-free countries have no criminals or violence? They certainly do, and it is often far more brutal because individuals cannot defend themselves from groups and knives are everywhere.
- shiroiushi 2y ago
  Spoken like an American who's never left his country, or even flown on an airplane. I live in a gun-free country, and it's quite peaceful, completely unlike America with all its mass shootings.
  - wakawaka28 2y ago
    You've probably never been to America or shot a gun. I have been abroad to some of the most gun-free places in the world and I'm quite pleased with how we live in the US. There aren't as many shootings as the media would have you believe. The people at the top who cry about guns really just want you to be a helpless sheep. They have an imperative which is to maintain power, even if it costs you your life.
    - insane_dreamer 2y ago
      > There aren't as many shootings as the media would have you believe Regardless of the media (and I agree TV news amplify all this stuff which is why we don't even have TV in our house), the statistics (not generated by the media) show much, much higher rates of homocide, both by individuals and police officers, in the US than any other industrialized country. Regardless of you how you personally feel, the US is inherently statistically unsafe compared to other industrialized nations, especially wealthier ones like Japan, Switzerland, the Nordic countries, etc.
      - wakawaka28 2y ago
        >Regardless of you how you personally feel, the US is inherently statistically unsafe compared to other industrialized nations, especially wealthier ones like Japan, Switzerland, the Nordic countries, etc. That may be but I don't think homicide is common in the US, even if it is more frequent than elsewhere. 5 in 100k is not common. I don't believe guns are to blame. I also think there are other cultural factors in play as the US is very culturally diverse compared to Nordic countries or Japan. I would be interested to know the number and severity of drug addictions per capita before considering that. Even reducing my risk of homicide from 5 in 100k to zero would not change my mind about guns. We need them to defend against all aggressors, even government actors. The police do not have a duty to protect you in the US, and even if they did they cannot be everywhere. People are quick to ridicule the idea that guns can protect you against the government these days but the logic is totally sound and has been proven again and again throughout history.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

insane_dreamer 2y ago

> we should make sure that they are not sociopaths and have empathy and compassion for other beings (the cops, not the surgeons) Exactly. And to be clear. I wasn't suggesting that cops go through the equivalent of 10 years of college + medical school. But now they get, what, 2-4 months training, in some cases just straight out of high school? But even more important is the screening -- and that's a lot of what those years of the medical school process does.