4 ms·

>Part of the original problem was too many of the wrong kind of people becoming -- or remaining -- police in the first place. There are always going to be some

>Part of the original problem was too many of the wrong kind of people becoming -- or remaining -- police in the first place. There are always going to be some bad actors in any profession. Being violent to an appropriate extent is part of being a cop. When billionaires fund social media psyops to convince people that their friendly neighborhood cops are out to get them, and they'd be better off without police protection, that distorts public perception of police performance. Perceived problems with police need to be investigated carefully. Stirring the public into a frenzy every time some cop looks bad on video is harmful to everyone. >It's reasonable to apply that same high bar to police, who have much greater latitude in exercising that power, up to and including the power to kill their fellow citizens, than doctors do. No, it's not reasonable to expect police to go through a similar amount of rigor as a doctor. The job just isn't that complex, and there is nothing inherent about possibly killing people that requires a comparable amount of training. If being a cop did require such rigors, we couldn't afford to have police at all. >I don't think any young person who likes the idea of being able to walk around with a gun on their hip, being a police officer, anymore than I think any young person who likes cutting people open should become a surgeon. There's nothing wrong with walking around with a gun on your hip, whether you're a cop or not. I get what you're trying to say but there's only so much anyone can do to discern anyone's internal motivations for picking a career. As long as those motivations aren't evil or likely to interfere with their job performance, I don't care.

cr125rider 2y ago
Have we outsourced parenting and discipline to police and teachers? We’re just burning them out instead of trying to properly raise a family?
- chung8123 2y ago
  It certainly feels that way with teachers but how do we get the data to know?
gruez 2y ago
>When billionaires fund social media psyops to convince people that their friendly neighborhood cops are out to get them, and they'd be better off without police protection, that distorts public perception of police performance. source?
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
rickydroll 2y ago
A few years ago, a friend of mine taught creative writing and literature at a state college. Her class was one of the requirements for the criminal justice program. Just by observing the students, she could tell which ones were in criminal justice. Her observation was that the criminal justice students were, at best, bullies and had no respect for fellow students or teachers. You're right. We don't have to have cops go through the same rigorous training as surgeons, but at least we should make sure that they are not sociopaths and have empathy and compassion for other beings (the cops, not the surgeons).
- shiroiushi 2y ago
  There's another problem though: if you only allow compassionate, empathic people to be police, you won't have any police in America. Those kinds of people don't want to be police, especially in a country with so much gun violence and much of the population armed and apparently having sporadic mental problems and where violence is such a normal part of daily life. It takes a "special" kind of person to want to be a cop in that kind of environment. It's very different in peaceful, gun-free countries.
  - wakawaka28 2y ago
    >It's very different in peaceful, gun-free countries. You think gun-free countries have no criminals or violence? They certainly do, and it is often far more brutal because individuals cannot defend themselves from groups and knives are everywhere.
    - shiroiushi 2y ago
      Spoken like an American who's never left his country, or even flown on an airplane. I live in a gun-free country, and it's quite peaceful, completely unlike America with all its mass shootings.
      - wakawaka28 2y ago
        You've probably never been to America or shot a gun. I have been abroad to some of the most gun-free places in the world and I'm quite pleased with how we live in the US. There aren't as many shootings as the media would have you believe. The people at the top who cry about guns really just want you to be a helpless sheep. They have an imperative which is to maintain power, even if it costs you your life.
thecrash 2y ago
> friendly neighborhood cops There's a reason that you think the cops are friendly and other people don't. But the reason is not distorted media consumption. It's because the cops actually treat different people very differently. Many people who are routinely harassed and abused by police would be similarly surprised to learn that you find them to be so friendly. What seems to you to be an elaborate psyop conspiracy to demonize the police is actually just ordinary people in different social circumstances from you showing what reality looks like in their position.
- wakawaka28 2y ago
  >What seems to you to be an elaborate psyop conspiracy to demonize the police is actually just ordinary people in different social circumstances from you showing what reality looks like in their position. No, what I'm talking about is a very well-funded campaign with support from the richest people. They have little interest in you having adequate police protection. They are sabotaging each other and the public at large by making people think the problems with police are far more severe and widespread than they are.
  - insane_dreamer 2y ago
    this reads like pure conjecture; more importantly, a motivation is lacking. I don't like wealthly billionaires, but I do know they aren't afraid of the police (which can be paid off), so there's not really a motivation to rally the public to reduce police power.
    - wakawaka28 2y ago
      It's not conjecture, you can see the minions of certain rich people talking about it. Of course these people aren't afraid of police. They have top police protection as well as private armed security. There are many ways to make money from destabilization of cities or countries. For example, you could play real estate in "distressed" areas, bet against businesses that can't possibly stay open in the face of crime, and also fund politicians that claim to have a solution to the problem you are creating.
insane_dreamer 2y ago
> There's nothing wrong with walking around with a gun on your hip, whether you're a cop or not. I happen to think that there is. If you have a gun on your hip you probably won't shoot anyone with a gun. But the chances of shooting someone with a gun are non-zero. If you don't have a gun on your hip, the chances of shooting someone with that gun are zero. I like those chances better. (The 2A was good for its time and make sense in the context in which it was written; it has no place in today's world.) On-duty police fatally shoot about 1,000 people every year.[0] That's in the US. Guess how many on-duty police in the U.K. or Japan fatally shoot every year? [1][2] [0] https://manhattan.institute/article/fatal-police-shootings-and-race-a-review-of-the-evidence-and-suggestions-for-future-research https://manhattan.institute/article/fatal-police-shootings-a... [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_killings_by_law_enforcement_officers_in_the_United_Kingdom https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_killings_by_law_enforc... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_with_annual_rates_and_counts_for_killings_by_law_enforcement_officers https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_with_annual_...
- climb_stealth 2y ago
  I always have to think of this one episode of A Touch of Frost I believe where a murdering gunman was on the loose in the UK. And it triggered this big mobilisation where suddenly all the cops had to be equipped with pistols. Because the typical cop would just have a billystick to go on patrol with. At some point in time this stopped being normal. AFAIK nowadays every cop in Europe has a pistol on themselves. Surely that's not actually necessary ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  - Jensson 2y ago
    > AFAIK nowadays every cop in Europe has a pistol on themselves. Surely that's not actually necessary ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Once even a small fraction of criminals starts to have guns and use those to kill cops to get away that becomes necessary, yes. Then once cops starts to have guns the criminals stops shooting them as much, the transition is very quick as once police has a gun the criminal risks his life by shooting, while before the police had guns the criminal was perfectly safe using his gun. This transition happened in most European countries, but not all. And this costs basically nothing, the amount of deaths from police shootings in Europe is minimal even if you include warranted police shootings.

cr125rider 2y ago

Have we outsourced parenting and discipline to police and teachers? We’re just burning them out instead of trying to properly raise a family?

chung8123 2y ago
It certainly feels that way with teachers but how do we get the data to know?

gruez 2y ago

>When billionaires fund social media psyops to convince people that their friendly neighborhood cops are out to get them, and they'd be better off without police protection, that distorts public perception of police performance. source?

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

rickydroll 2y ago

A few years ago, a friend of mine taught creative writing and literature at a state college. Her class was one of the requirements for the criminal justice program. Just by observing the students, she could tell which ones were in criminal justice. Her observation was that the criminal justice students were, at best, bullies and had no respect for fellow students or teachers. You're right. We don't have to have cops go through the same rigorous training as surgeons, but at least we should make sure that they are not sociopaths and have empathy and compassion for other beings (the cops, not the surgeons).

shiroiushi 2y ago
There's another problem though: if you only allow compassionate, empathic people to be police, you won't have any police in America. Those kinds of people don't want to be police, especially in a country with so much gun violence and much of the population armed and apparently having sporadic mental problems and where violence is such a normal part of daily life. It takes a "special" kind of person to want to be a cop in that kind of environment. It's very different in peaceful, gun-free countries.
- wakawaka28 2y ago
  >It's very different in peaceful, gun-free countries. You think gun-free countries have no criminals or violence? They certainly do, and it is often far more brutal because individuals cannot defend themselves from groups and knives are everywhere.
  - shiroiushi 2y ago
    Spoken like an American who's never left his country, or even flown on an airplane. I live in a gun-free country, and it's quite peaceful, completely unlike America with all its mass shootings.
    - wakawaka28 2y ago
      You've probably never been to America or shot a gun. I have been abroad to some of the most gun-free places in the world and I'm quite pleased with how we live in the US. There aren't as many shootings as the media would have you believe. The people at the top who cry about guns really just want you to be a helpless sheep. They have an imperative which is to maintain power, even if it costs you your life.

thecrash 2y ago

> friendly neighborhood cops There's a reason that you think the cops are friendly and other people don't. But the reason is not distorted media consumption. It's because the cops actually treat different people very differently. Many people who are routinely harassed and abused by police would be similarly surprised to learn that you find them to be so friendly. What seems to you to be an elaborate psyop conspiracy to demonize the police is actually just ordinary people in different social circumstances from you showing what reality looks like in their position.

wakawaka28 2y ago
>What seems to you to be an elaborate psyop conspiracy to demonize the police is actually just ordinary people in different social circumstances from you showing what reality looks like in their position. No, what I'm talking about is a very well-funded campaign with support from the richest people. They have little interest in you having adequate police protection. They are sabotaging each other and the public at large by making people think the problems with police are far more severe and widespread than they are.
- insane_dreamer 2y ago
  this reads like pure conjecture; more importantly, a motivation is lacking. I don't like wealthly billionaires, but I do know they aren't afraid of the police (which can be paid off), so there's not really a motivation to rally the public to reduce police power.
  - wakawaka28 2y ago
    It's not conjecture, you can see the minions of certain rich people talking about it. Of course these people aren't afraid of police. They have top police protection as well as private armed security. There are many ways to make money from destabilization of cities or countries. For example, you could play real estate in "distressed" areas, bet against businesses that can't possibly stay open in the face of crime, and also fund politicians that claim to have a solution to the problem you are creating.

insane_dreamer 2y ago

> There's nothing wrong with walking around with a gun on your hip, whether you're a cop or not. I happen to think that there is. If you have a gun on your hip you probably won't shoot anyone with a gun. But the chances of shooting someone with a gun are non-zero. If you don't have a gun on your hip, the chances of shooting someone with that gun are zero. I like those chances better. (The 2A was good for its time and make sense in the context in which it was written; it has no place in today's world.) On-duty police fatally shoot about 1,000 people every year.[0] That's in the US. Guess how many on-duty police in the U.K. or Japan fatally shoot every year? [1][2] [0] https://manhattan.institute/article/fatal-police-shootings-and-race-a-review-of-the-evidence-and-suggestions-for-future-research https://manhattan.institute/article/fatal-police-shootings-a... [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_killings_by_law_enforcement_officers_in_the_United_Kingdom https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_killings_by_law_enforc... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_with_annual_rates_and_counts_for_killings_by_law_enforcement_officers https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_with_annual_...

climb_stealth 2y ago
I always have to think of this one episode of A Touch of Frost I believe where a murdering gunman was on the loose in the UK. And it triggered this big mobilisation where suddenly all the cops had to be equipped with pistols. Because the typical cop would just have a billystick to go on patrol with. At some point in time this stopped being normal. AFAIK nowadays every cop in Europe has a pistol on themselves. Surely that's not actually necessary ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
- Jensson 2y ago
  > AFAIK nowadays every cop in Europe has a pistol on themselves. Surely that's not actually necessary ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Once even a small fraction of criminals starts to have guns and use those to kill cops to get away that becomes necessary, yes. Then once cops starts to have guns the criminals stops shooting them as much, the transition is very quick as once police has a gun the criminal risks his life by shooting, while before the police had guns the criminal was perfectly safe using his gun. This transition happened in most European countries, but not all. And this costs basically nothing, the amount of deaths from police shootings in Europe is minimal even if you include warranted police shootings.