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> We're leaving the maintenance of poorly build infrastructure to our kids That's standard practice by the book though. No generation has ever left anything b

> We're leaving the maintenance of poorly build infrastructure to our kids That's standard practice by the book though. No generation has ever left anything better than that to the future ones. [1] Also: future does not exist, it's been invented by old men thinking of themselves as future reborn children (or whatever their beliefs told them to believe). But the future generations, not knowing better, will assume that whatever we are leaving behind it's how it is supposed to be. A trivial example: young people now don't complain about the ad infested internet or the addiction driven social networks, it's how it is supposed to work for them. But also: if you don't give them something, they won't (can't) miss it. Will they miss the rotary phone or the walkman? No, they won't. In the same way I never missed washing clothes in a river, like my grandma did. I was born with the washing machine and I'm thankful for that. [1] imagine that the Colosseum's name comes from people seeing a colossal statue in front of it, the statue was nicknamed "The Colossus" (nobody knew who that was) so obviously the building in front of it became "The Colosseum". Little did they know the statue was of Nero, the Roman Emperor, and the building was an amphitheatre built in a different period. They did not know about Nero, about Vespasian, the Flavian dynasty, the gladiators or the naumachia, but they thought it was good enough to use it as a market...

seoulmetro 2y ago
>No generation has ever left anything better than that to the future ones. ??? We were leaving some of the best products of our labour in the 1800s and early 1900s (for some parts of the world). I think you're misunderstanding the point of tech fading but infrastructure staying. For innovation, sure, it's going to fade, but there are thousands of things we know that do not fade that we could be building today to leave our next generations. That is what they did. We do not do it, not even slightly... AND it's easier for us to do so, yet still we don't.
- peoplefromibiza 2y ago
  > We were leaving some of the best products of our labour in the 1800s and early 1900s And also all of the mistakes of the industrial revolution... Including pollution, horrible living and working conditions, deadly workplaces, child labour, exploitation and oppression of the workers, unfair distribution of wealth etc etc See the construction of the Paris underground or the grim consequences of using asbestos in buildings. > I think you're misunderstanding the point of tech fading but infrastructure staying. I think you are moving the goalpost "We're leaving the maintenance of poorly build infrastructure to our kids" like we always did. Medieval Bologna was full of tall towers, only a handful of them survived to this day. Because they were poorly built and even worse maintained.
  - seoulmetro 2y ago
    You seem to still misunderstand what I wrote. Do you know the difference between infrastructure and ideas?
    - peoplefromibiza 2y ago
      > Do you know the difference between infrastructure and ideas? Do you? Can you make an example of "We were leaving some of the best products of our labour in the 1800s and early 1900s"? Have you ever read Slavery, Capitalism and the Industrial Revolution? Are you aware of the Williams Thesis? I would like to discuss the matter and not read your ad hominem, because it's honestly the least interesting thing in the World and you are not even good at it.
      - seoulmetro 2y ago
        You think those are infrastructure? Those are innovations and technology, i.e. ideas. Infrastructure is tangible.
        peoplefromibiza 2y ago
        > You think those are infrastructure? Those are innovations and technology, i.e. ideas. You still haven't provided any example... Last time we left something valuable to future generations was the Romans with their aqueducts. 1800-1900? not so much. > Infrastructure is tangible. Is beating around the bush really the best you can do? Looks like you never heard about (and never took advantage of) the education system... Some other example of intangible infrastructure: the judicial system and the government. you're welcome.
        peoplefromibiza 2y ago
        Anyway, what you really don't understand is how much the context changed. Nowadays "leaving it to the kids" means grandparents living something to their grandkids. In the past it meant a 30 year old man leaving something behind for their 12 years old children. Some of the infrastructures we are leaving behind was already in place when my mother was being born (in the late 1940s). It is still functioning. I wouldn't call it poor built, it is probably poorly maintained, but it's understandable when the only people willing to maintain it are old folks or immigrants with no other option and the knowledge about the inner workings are lost or degraded. But my generation and the generation before me are leaving to our descendants the f*ing internet which is an unprecedented marvel if you ask me, comparable to the agricultural revolution, the steam engine, the printing press and the electricity.

seoulmetro 2y ago

>No generation has ever left anything better than that to the future ones. ??? We were leaving some of the best products of our labour in the 1800s and early 1900s (for some parts of the world). I think you're misunderstanding the point of tech fading but infrastructure staying. For innovation, sure, it's going to fade, but there are thousands of things we know that do not fade that we could be building today to leave our next generations. That is what they did. We do not do it, not even slightly... AND it's easier for us to do so, yet still we don't.

peoplefromibiza 2y ago
> We were leaving some of the best products of our labour in the 1800s and early 1900s And also all of the mistakes of the industrial revolution... Including pollution, horrible living and working conditions, deadly workplaces, child labour, exploitation and oppression of the workers, unfair distribution of wealth etc etc See the construction of the Paris underground or the grim consequences of using asbestos in buildings. > I think you're misunderstanding the point of tech fading but infrastructure staying. I think you are moving the goalpost "We're leaving the maintenance of poorly build infrastructure to our kids" like we always did. Medieval Bologna was full of tall towers, only a handful of them survived to this day. Because they were poorly built and even worse maintained.
- seoulmetro 2y ago
  You seem to still misunderstand what I wrote. Do you know the difference between infrastructure and ideas?
  - peoplefromibiza 2y ago
    > Do you know the difference between infrastructure and ideas? Do you? Can you make an example of "We were leaving some of the best products of our labour in the 1800s and early 1900s"? Have you ever read Slavery, Capitalism and the Industrial Revolution? Are you aware of the Williams Thesis? I would like to discuss the matter and not read your ad hominem, because it's honestly the least interesting thing in the World and you are not even good at it.
    - seoulmetro 2y ago
      You think those are infrastructure? Those are innovations and technology, i.e. ideas. Infrastructure is tangible.
      - peoplefromibiza 2y ago
        > You think those are infrastructure? Those are innovations and technology, i.e. ideas. You still haven't provided any example... Last time we left something valuable to future generations was the Romans with their aqueducts. 1800-1900? not so much. > Infrastructure is tangible. Is beating around the bush really the best you can do? Looks like you never heard about (and never took advantage of) the education system... Some other example of intangible infrastructure: the judicial system and the government. you're welcome.
      - peoplefromibiza 2y ago
        Anyway, what you really don't understand is how much the context changed. Nowadays "leaving it to the kids" means grandparents living something to their grandkids. In the past it meant a 30 year old man leaving something behind for their 12 years old children. Some of the infrastructures we are leaving behind was already in place when my mother was being born (in the late 1940s). It is still functioning. I wouldn't call it poor built, it is probably poorly maintained, but it's understandable when the only people willing to maintain it are old folks or immigrants with no other option and the knowledge about the inner workings are lost or degraded. But my generation and the generation before me are leaving to our descendants the f*ing internet which is an unprecedented marvel if you ask me, comparable to the agricultural revolution, the steam engine, the printing press and the electricity.