3 ms·

They have an effective monopoly.

sirsinsalot 2y ago
Not just on tickets, but on venues, catering, security, logistics. It's pretty bad.
account42 2y ago
... for a completely optional form of entertainment. At the very least you have the choice not to go to any concerts until there are better options. You can also make that clear to your favorite bands.
- quantified 2y ago
  The extra fees are shared with venues and bands. Keeps them on TM's side.
- skywhopper 2y ago
  lol, people and bands have been complaining about it for 30 years and it’s only gotten worse. Yes, you could skip concerts for the rest of your life, I suppose, to make a point. But it’s not going to fix anything.
  - account42 2y ago
    Complaining yes, but how many people are actually putting their foot down? As for bands, they may actually be profiting from this scheme where ticketmaster ensures higher prices while taking the blame. If they really cared enough they could chose not to deal with Ticketmaster. Sure, that would limit their choices in venues which could mean lower potential for profit. Probably not going to be a real issue for the the more popular groups. And yes, if there are no concerts with acceptable terms (and that's really a hypothetical if) then don't go to any for the rest of your life. You make it sound like this is some kind of required part of the human experience when it is just one of many possible ways to spend your time. Even if you are really into music, concerts are just one way to experience it - and when it comes to audio quality, a fairly crappy one.
    - Spivak 2y ago
      It's possible you can put your foot down, lots of venues will sell you paper tickets at the box office. It's inconvenient but they also don't charge TM fees sooo. It's what I do since they open the box office during any of their events. Just get tickets for the next few shows right there. > Even if you are really into music, concerts are just one way to experience it - and when it comes to audio quality, a fairly crappy one. This fundamentally misunderstands why people go to see live music and honestly maybe what people enjoy about music entirely.
    - TylerE 2y ago
      The bands are absolutely profiting. Ticketmaster is basically “customer punching bag ad a service”.
      - mattmaroon 2y ago
        The bands at the top are absolutely not profiting, they’re losing money over it. Instead of a healthy ecosystem of promoters willing to pay them market rates, they’re dealing with a monopsony that depresses earnings. They HAVE to go through TicketMaster venues, because TM has locked up 85% of large ones, which means they have to accept whatever fee the promoter (LiveNation, same company) is willing to pay them. That’s part of why AEG sued them, they are a giant international promoter who is effectively boxed out of the American market by TMs stranglehold on venues and vertical integration. Venue owners are profiting. LN/TM can pay them a lot for exclusive rights thanks to their monopoly-inflated profits.
        TylerE 2y ago
        The bands get more than a small cut of the various fees, and especially the upcharge things like Platinum tickets.
        mattmaroon 2y ago
        No they don’t, that’s not how the money works in concerts. The bands get paid a flat fee by the promoter. You can Google this if you don’t believe me but I know from working with concert promoters. Why would Ticketmaster/live nation pay them at all? They don’t have to, the bands don’t have any other places to play and they make most of their income from live shows.
dml2135 2y ago
On large venues for big name artists. Granted, I live in NYC, which probably has one of the most vibrant local music scenes in the country. But it's not like nowhere else has local bands that play at small venues. It feels like a lot of the people that complain about ticketmaster's monopoly have never branched out from Billboard chart artists.
- quantified 2y ago
  There are a lot of musicians that aren't on the charts that play in Ticketmaster-controlled venues.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- to11mtm 2y ago
  It's weird? Even the most 'hole in the wall' places around here have deals with LN/TM, short of a bar-band or niche-local joint. One of the more 'fun' ways that LN/TM did shenanigans at the past I observed: Metal shows at smaller places in the Detroit area like Harpo's (famous place but known for the sketch area) or Token Lounge (literally a bar with a dance floor and stage, pretty fun tho) you'd have one of the local small/startup bands selling tickets, often -below- cost at the box office. Why? If they sold enough tickets, they got to play as an opener. Yes some scammers would try to fake this, but I never saw anyone actually get 'taken'. And yes I'd buy them if I didn't already have them to help the locals out. That said, the concerts at those smaller venues, despite being TM/LN, were in the 20-30 dollar range after fees. Not 'top billboard' type stuff per se but Children of Bodom, Lacuna Coil, and other 'popular but niche' bands in the 2005-2007 timeframe.

Not just on tickets, but on venues, catering, security, logistics. It's pretty bad.

... for a completely optional form of entertainment. At the very least you have the choice not to go to any concerts until there are better options. You can also make that clear to your favorite bands.

quantified 2y ago
The extra fees are shared with venues and bands. Keeps them on TM's side.
skywhopper 2y ago
lol, people and bands have been complaining about it for 30 years and it’s only gotten worse. Yes, you could skip concerts for the rest of your life, I suppose, to make a point. But it’s not going to fix anything.
- account42 2y ago
  Complaining yes, but how many people are actually putting their foot down? As for bands, they may actually be profiting from this scheme where ticketmaster ensures higher prices while taking the blame. If they really cared enough they could chose not to deal with Ticketmaster. Sure, that would limit their choices in venues which could mean lower potential for profit. Probably not going to be a real issue for the the more popular groups. And yes, if there are no concerts with acceptable terms (and that's really a hypothetical if) then don't go to any for the rest of your life. You make it sound like this is some kind of required part of the human experience when it is just one of many possible ways to spend your time. Even if you are really into music, concerts are just one way to experience it - and when it comes to audio quality, a fairly crappy one.
  - Spivak 2y ago
    It's possible you can put your foot down, lots of venues will sell you paper tickets at the box office. It's inconvenient but they also don't charge TM fees sooo. It's what I do since they open the box office during any of their events. Just get tickets for the next few shows right there. > Even if you are really into music, concerts are just one way to experience it - and when it comes to audio quality, a fairly crappy one. This fundamentally misunderstands why people go to see live music and honestly maybe what people enjoy about music entirely.
  - TylerE 2y ago
    The bands are absolutely profiting. Ticketmaster is basically “customer punching bag ad a service”.
    - mattmaroon 2y ago
      The bands at the top are absolutely not profiting, they’re losing money over it. Instead of a healthy ecosystem of promoters willing to pay them market rates, they’re dealing with a monopsony that depresses earnings. They HAVE to go through TicketMaster venues, because TM has locked up 85% of large ones, which means they have to accept whatever fee the promoter (LiveNation, same company) is willing to pay them. That’s part of why AEG sued them, they are a giant international promoter who is effectively boxed out of the American market by TMs stranglehold on venues and vertical integration. Venue owners are profiting. LN/TM can pay them a lot for exclusive rights thanks to their monopoly-inflated profits.
      - TylerE 2y ago
        The bands get more than a small cut of the various fees, and especially the upcharge things like Platinum tickets.
        mattmaroon 2y ago
        No they don’t, that’s not how the money works in concerts. The bands get paid a flat fee by the promoter. You can Google this if you don’t believe me but I know from working with concert promoters. Why would Ticketmaster/live nation pay them at all? They don’t have to, the bands don’t have any other places to play and they make most of their income from live shows.

dml2135 2y ago

On large venues for big name artists. Granted, I live in NYC, which probably has one of the most vibrant local music scenes in the country. But it's not like nowhere else has local bands that play at small venues. It feels like a lot of the people that complain about ticketmaster's monopoly have never branched out from Billboard chart artists.

quantified 2y ago
There are a lot of musicians that aren't on the charts that play in Ticketmaster-controlled venues.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
to11mtm 2y ago
It's weird? Even the most 'hole in the wall' places around here have deals with LN/TM, short of a bar-band or niche-local joint. One of the more 'fun' ways that LN/TM did shenanigans at the past I observed: Metal shows at smaller places in the Detroit area like Harpo's (famous place but known for the sketch area) or Token Lounge (literally a bar with a dance floor and stage, pretty fun tho) you'd have one of the local small/startup bands selling tickets, often -below- cost at the box office. Why? If they sold enough tickets, they got to play as an opener. Yes some scammers would try to fake this, but I never saw anyone actually get 'taken'. And yes I'd buy them if I didn't already have them to help the locals out. That said, the concerts at those smaller venues, despite being TM/LN, were in the 20-30 dollar range after fees. Not 'top billboard' type stuff per se but Children of Bodom, Lacuna Coil, and other 'popular but niche' bands in the 2005-2007 timeframe.