5 ms·

I don't think the existence of Wayland means X11 is deprecated. Lots of people (including myself) would prefer the perfectly working X11 than the feature-incomp

I don't think the existence of Wayland means X11 is deprecated. Lots of people (including myself) would prefer the perfectly working X11 than the feature-incomplete backward-incompatible "modern" wayland

necrotic_comp 2y ago
I haven't yet seen any compelling reason to move off of X11. It's been years since I've checked - what's the current state of the art ?
- ChoHag 2y ago
  > what's the current state of the art ? Wayland is going to make 2024 the year of Linux on the Desktop! Any day now...
  - LelouBil 2y ago
    Yeah, but it is slowly getting better. Not advocating for 2024 (or 2025) but I still think someday it will, having seen multiple usability and feature improvements. (Not only talking about wayland here)
  - intelVISA 2y ago
    I thought it was already the year of Linux on the Desktop?? Jokes aside if you can avoid anti-cheats (rootkits) DXVK makes a lot of Windows workflows very accessible on Linux.
    - vidarh 2y ago
      For me, the year of Linux on the Desktop was '94. It's been my main desktop at home ever since, and for wor as well the majority of time - but with some obnoxious detours.
    - account42 2y ago
      > DXVK makes a lot of Windows workflows very accessible on Linux. And it has achieved that with X11.
- SSLy 2y ago
  https://github.com/ValveSoftware/gamescope https://github.com/ValveSoftware/gamescope is the one actually competent wayland WM.
  - p_l 2y ago
    Noticeably it doesn't export Wayland to applications running underneath unless you enable an experimental flag, and half the reason for its existence is that it can be entirely bypassed by related Vulkan layer extension.
  - Gormo 2y ago
    And it works great as a standalone X11 server too.
rcxdude 2y ago
It's deprecated by the people who wrote it, and AFAIK no-one else has taken up the task of maintaining it. Doesn't mean you can't use it (I still use it still, thanks to said breakage), but it's not exactly thriving.
- vidarh 2y ago
  It's still seeing regular releases. It's split into modules now, but the xorg-server module last had a release in April, I think, with multiple contributors, and at least two people are issuing release announcements. Maybe I'll consider Wayland again in a few years (though, who knows, by then maybe I'll have fallen for the temptation to write my own X server too...), but for now, Xorg works, receiving fixes, and doesn't require me to change anything else in my workflow for no good reason.
  - seba_dos1 2y ago
    > It's still seeing regular releases. With very limited scope. There's already hardware out there that will likely never be properly supported by Xorg. Though Xwayland - and hence a big chunk of Xorg - will, of course, still live a long life.
    - vidarh 2y ago
      If that affects me one day, maybe I'll care about that. I doubt that'll be a concern until sometimes next decade at the earliest for my use.
    - p_l 2y ago
      Unfortunately Wayland means increased fragmentation in the hw support, not less :(
    - Gormo 2y ago
      Considering that hardware vendors are typically writing and upstreaming their own drivers, I don't see how that could be.
- llm_trw 2y ago
jrm4 2y ago
Even funnier, I have a bunch of rando computers and servers, some with friends and family with different distros...and at any given time, I'm not sure which I'm using. (Which I suppose means that Wayland has matured a lot..finally, but still)

necrotic_comp 2y ago

I haven't yet seen any compelling reason to move off of X11. It's been years since I've checked - what's the current state of the art ?

ChoHag 2y ago
> what's the current state of the art ? Wayland is going to make 2024 the year of Linux on the Desktop! Any day now...
- LelouBil 2y ago
  Yeah, but it is slowly getting better. Not advocating for 2024 (or 2025) but I still think someday it will, having seen multiple usability and feature improvements. (Not only talking about wayland here)
- intelVISA 2y ago
  I thought it was already the year of Linux on the Desktop?? Jokes aside if you can avoid anti-cheats (rootkits) DXVK makes a lot of Windows workflows very accessible on Linux.
  - vidarh 2y ago
    For me, the year of Linux on the Desktop was '94. It's been my main desktop at home ever since, and for wor as well the majority of time - but with some obnoxious detours.
  - account42 2y ago
    > DXVK makes a lot of Windows workflows very accessible on Linux. And it has achieved that with X11.
SSLy 2y ago
https://github.com/ValveSoftware/gamescope https://github.com/ValveSoftware/gamescope is the one actually competent wayland WM.
- p_l 2y ago
  Noticeably it doesn't export Wayland to applications running underneath unless you enable an experimental flag, and half the reason for its existence is that it can be entirely bypassed by related Vulkan layer extension.
- Gormo 2y ago
  And it works great as a standalone X11 server too.

rcxdude 2y ago

It's deprecated by the people who wrote it, and AFAIK no-one else has taken up the task of maintaining it. Doesn't mean you can't use it (I still use it still, thanks to said breakage), but it's not exactly thriving.

vidarh 2y ago
It's still seeing regular releases. It's split into modules now, but the xorg-server module last had a release in April, I think, with multiple contributors, and at least two people are issuing release announcements. Maybe I'll consider Wayland again in a few years (though, who knows, by then maybe I'll have fallen for the temptation to write my own X server too...), but for now, Xorg works, receiving fixes, and doesn't require me to change anything else in my workflow for no good reason.
- seba_dos1 2y ago
  > It's still seeing regular releases. With very limited scope. There's already hardware out there that will likely never be properly supported by Xorg. Though Xwayland - and hence a big chunk of Xorg - will, of course, still live a long life.
  - vidarh 2y ago
    If that affects me one day, maybe I'll care about that. I doubt that'll be a concern until sometimes next decade at the earliest for my use.
  - p_l 2y ago
    Unfortunately Wayland means increased fragmentation in the hw support, not less :(
  - Gormo 2y ago
    Considering that hardware vendors are typically writing and upstreaming their own drivers, I don't see how that could be.
llm_trw 2y ago

jrm4 2y ago

Even funnier, I have a bunch of rando computers and servers, some with friends and family with different distros...and at any given time, I'm not sure which I'm using. (Which I suppose means that Wayland has matured a lot..finally, but still)