3 ms·

My observation is that both of those could be linked. We might be reaching the limits of technology. It means that to push boundaries we need more money to buy

by Ygg2 2y ago

My observation is that both of those could be linked. We might be reaching the limits of technology. It means that to push boundaries we need more money to buy/construct new tests. In other words, you need exponentially more money. Which leads to the kind of blockbusterization of science. You don't get hundred blockbusters each year, instead you get two, by team with track record. Which sounds a lot like institutional decay.

dartos 2y ago
I think you’re putting the cart before the horse. Needing exponentially more money is the decay. The blockbusterization of science is a symptom.
- Ygg2 2y ago
  Exponentially more money isn't just sign of institutional decay. Resources/energy required to discover X ray is a grain of sand on a beach compared to energies required to discover Higg's boson. That's just energy. Compare cost to make an X ray tube vs LHC. Science used to be able to snatch low hanging fruit. Now those are picked, but people still expect same rate of innovation.
  - dartos 2y ago
    > but people still expect same rate of innovation This sounds like the decay, not the rising cost. I’m sure every researcher understands this, but not every executive or shareholder. The lack of trust in your workers / focus on hyper growth is the issue. Like you say, discoveries become more expensive over time, but we’re seeing similar institutional decay in non research institutions as well, so that can’t be the only factor. Like how much more expensive is it to teach a single college student now than it was 20 years ago. In all honesty, probably much cheaper. Especially when you start looking at online classes. So why is college in the states so much more expensive? It’s largely because of administrative bloat, which, among many other weird incentives, are symptoms of decay. And why would you need administrators? IMO, it’s because you’re unwilling to trust small departments or individuals to tech effectively.
    - Ygg2 2y ago
      > Like you say, discoveries become more expensive over time, but we’re seeing similar institutional decay in non research institutions as well, Sure, but they also might be the issue of ending on the Saturation curve. For example, chip manufacture is getting more and more expensive because it's getting up to the limit of an atom. That's caused by physics and not economics. What is caused by economics is the expectation of exponential growth.
      - dartos 2y ago
        Right, but I don’t think the institutional decay is caused by things needing more money to produce or research. It’s caused by the need (desire?) to either maintain or grow the same rate of production or discovery over time. The disconnect between possible reality and economic expectation is the cause of institutional decay. Maybe a better term is “institutional dementia” Institutions are just groups of people, after all.

by Ygg2 2y ago

dartos 2y ago

I think you’re putting the cart before the horse. Needing exponentially more money is the decay. The blockbusterization of science is a symptom.

Ygg2 2y ago
Exponentially more money isn't just sign of institutional decay. Resources/energy required to discover X ray is a grain of sand on a beach compared to energies required to discover Higg's boson. That's just energy. Compare cost to make an X ray tube vs LHC. Science used to be able to snatch low hanging fruit. Now those are picked, but people still expect same rate of innovation.
- dartos 2y ago
  > but people still expect same rate of innovation This sounds like the decay, not the rising cost. I’m sure every researcher understands this, but not every executive or shareholder. The lack of trust in your workers / focus on hyper growth is the issue. Like you say, discoveries become more expensive over time, but we’re seeing similar institutional decay in non research institutions as well, so that can’t be the only factor. Like how much more expensive is it to teach a single college student now than it was 20 years ago. In all honesty, probably much cheaper. Especially when you start looking at online classes. So why is college in the states so much more expensive? It’s largely because of administrative bloat, which, among many other weird incentives, are symptoms of decay. And why would you need administrators? IMO, it’s because you’re unwilling to trust small departments or individuals to tech effectively.
  - Ygg2 2y ago
    > Like you say, discoveries become more expensive over time, but we’re seeing similar institutional decay in non research institutions as well, Sure, but they also might be the issue of ending on the Saturation curve. For example, chip manufacture is getting more and more expensive because it's getting up to the limit of an atom. That's caused by physics and not economics. What is caused by economics is the expectation of exponential growth.
    - dartos 2y ago
      Right, but I don’t think the institutional decay is caused by things needing more money to produce or research. It’s caused by the need (desire?) to either maintain or grow the same rate of production or discovery over time. The disconnect between possible reality and economic expectation is the cause of institutional decay. Maybe a better term is “institutional dementia” Institutions are just groups of people, after all.