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DevOps has different meanings to different organizations. Just by skimming over the comments here the problem becomes obvious. For some it is basically a platfo

by siva7 2y ago

DevOps has different meanings to different organizations. Just by skimming over the comments here the problem becomes obvious. For some it is basically a platform integration team that assist product teams for what they call devops, for others they confuse it as a modern sysadmin role and for others like product developers they confuse being on-call "24x7" as some kind of devops principles. It's a heavily abused term, even as we have a common industry definition which is grounded on scientific methods, all of the above examples are still common misconceptions about devops.

namaria 2y ago
Ten thousand organizations the world over have ten thousand problems. One person with a shinny resume and big corp names on it will come out and publish some manifesto about how they figure one problem out at one very particular company. Because that particular company becomes one of the top 10 worldwide, ten thousand companies will try to claim they do it to by throwing some job titles around. People realize it's bunk and search for the next silver bullet. Brooks warned us about seeking simple solutions to complex endeavors' problems nearly 40 years ago.
7bit 2y ago
> a modern sysadmin role As a sysadmin, I feel attacked. DevOps is not a modern used version of the sysadmin. It's a different shade with different expertise to apply to a slightly different field that what a sysadmin does. I've seen devoperators who don't know how to manage a server and I've seen sysadmins who don't know how to write scripts. One is not more modern or superior than the other.
- stevekemp 2y ago
  I started as a developer, and became a sysadmin by accident/necessity. Over the past 20ish years I've been: "sysadmin", "sre", "devops engineer", "cloud engineer", and "platform support engineer". Probably more titles, and roles, than I can remember to be honest. I write scripts, I automate systems (in the past with perl, then cfengine, puppet,etc) via the use of AMIs and standard templates. I use strace to debug problems, and diagnose networking issues with tcpdump/wireshark. Nowadays I mostly use EKS/K8S, but at heart I remember debugging broken deployments with GDB and patching binaries with emacs and I like those simpler times. I want to call myself a sysadmin, but people hiring for stuff want devops/cloud everywhere. It's all a mess. Still I like big networks and lots of systems, and it seems there's no shortage of things to improve no matter the size of the company.
arccy 2y ago
> even as we have a common industry definition which is grounded on scientific methods there's hardly anything scientific about devops, it's all about culture and people

by siva7 2y ago

namaria 2y ago

Ten thousand organizations the world over have ten thousand problems. One person with a shinny resume and big corp names on it will come out and publish some manifesto about how they figure one problem out at one very particular company. Because that particular company becomes one of the top 10 worldwide, ten thousand companies will try to claim they do it to by throwing some job titles around. People realize it's bunk and search for the next silver bullet. Brooks warned us about seeking simple solutions to complex endeavors' problems nearly 40 years ago.

7bit 2y ago

> a modern sysadmin role As a sysadmin, I feel attacked. DevOps is not a modern used version of the sysadmin. It's a different shade with different expertise to apply to a slightly different field that what a sysadmin does. I've seen devoperators who don't know how to manage a server and I've seen sysadmins who don't know how to write scripts. One is not more modern or superior than the other.

stevekemp 2y ago
I started as a developer, and became a sysadmin by accident/necessity. Over the past 20ish years I've been: "sysadmin", "sre", "devops engineer", "cloud engineer", and "platform support engineer". Probably more titles, and roles, than I can remember to be honest. I write scripts, I automate systems (in the past with perl, then cfengine, puppet,etc) via the use of AMIs and standard templates. I use strace to debug problems, and diagnose networking issues with tcpdump/wireshark. Nowadays I mostly use EKS/K8S, but at heart I remember debugging broken deployments with GDB and patching binaries with emacs and I like those simpler times. I want to call myself a sysadmin, but people hiring for stuff want devops/cloud everywhere. It's all a mess. Still I like big networks and lots of systems, and it seems there's no shortage of things to improve no matter the size of the company.

arccy 2y ago

> even as we have a common industry definition which is grounded on scientific methods there's hardly anything scientific about devops, it's all about culture and people