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Using alcohol has an effect on how I consciously experience things. I've heard from others that other drugs influence conscience even more. To me that's very s

Using alcohol has an effect on how I consciously experience things. I've heard from others that other drugs influence conscience even more. To me that's very strong evidence it is something physical, tied to functions of our bodies, and not something shared by everything.

RobertRies 2y ago
I entirely agree with this, and I likewise think it's quite damning. But panpsychists don't see it this way. This is "the combination problem" and I predict they will never be able to solve this. Edit: I should elaborate on how it relates. Some would say that the alcohol or foreign substances are disrupting the combination of the consciousness of the matter, disrupting the overall consciously experience that makes up your matter. So, for example, now there's a bunch of little consciousnesses that aren't "combined".
jerry1979 2y ago
But taking drugs also affects physiological things such as breathing, heart rate, salivation, sweat, etc. All of those things are tied to physical material that starts outside the body that our physical bodies manage thanks to evolutionary selection. We manage oxygen with breathing/heart rate, water for salivation and sweat, etc. The fact that the physical body and evolution also manage consciousness should probably be evidence that consciousness exists outside the body just like oxygen and water.
mistermann 2y ago
> To me that's very strong evidence it is something physical, tied to functions of our bodies, and not something shared by everything. The "is" physical (has a physical component, as opposed to equals or is purely) makes sense, but how does "not something shared by everything" logically follow?
- Scarblac 2y ago
  > but how does "not something shared by everything" logically follow? If someone else drinks alcohol, my consciousness doesn't change.
  - mistermann 2y ago
    That doesn't even attempt to answer the question. What does "consciousness doesn't change" mean?? Like, there's zero change in the state of it?

RobertRies 2y ago

I entirely agree with this, and I likewise think it's quite damning. But panpsychists don't see it this way. This is "the combination problem" and I predict they will never be able to solve this. Edit: I should elaborate on how it relates. Some would say that the alcohol or foreign substances are disrupting the combination of the consciousness of the matter, disrupting the overall consciously experience that makes up your matter. So, for example, now there's a bunch of little consciousnesses that aren't "combined".

jerry1979 2y ago

But taking drugs also affects physiological things such as breathing, heart rate, salivation, sweat, etc. All of those things are tied to physical material that starts outside the body that our physical bodies manage thanks to evolutionary selection. We manage oxygen with breathing/heart rate, water for salivation and sweat, etc. The fact that the physical body and evolution also manage consciousness should probably be evidence that consciousness exists outside the body just like oxygen and water.

mistermann 2y ago

> To me that's very strong evidence it is something physical, tied to functions of our bodies, and not something shared by everything. The "is" physical (has a physical component, as opposed to equals or is purely) makes sense, but how does "not something shared by everything" logically follow?

Scarblac 2y ago
> but how does "not something shared by everything" logically follow? If someone else drinks alcohol, my consciousness doesn't change.
- mistermann 2y ago
  That doesn't even attempt to answer the question. What does "consciousness doesn't change" mean?? Like, there's zero change in the state of it?