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There is a part of me that strongly identifies with the "Grizzly Man" and Supertramps of the world. Yeah, often they make stupid decisions and go into things un

There is a part of me that strongly identifies with the "Grizzly Man" and Supertramps of the world. Yeah, often they make stupid decisions and go into things unprepared. But they are willing to go into the unknown in a way the vast majority of society is not. They are trying to experience the world as humans throughout history have experienced the world. And their experience ending in their death isn't the condemnation that people seem to think it is. Because that's where we all end up. And they reached that point by doing things that were not just outside of their comfort zone but the comfort zone of every normie in this country. They are easy to ridicule from the safety of a youtube video, but these people actually lived in these places and experienced these things in a way the vast majority of modern humanity never will. It's easy to judge. It's far more difficult to live in a way that defies society. Even when those lives are cut short, I think it's worth exploring and celebrating. They were trying to buck the trend. They were real hackers in a way most on this site cannot really comprehend.

marcus_holmes 2y ago
I don't identify with it at all, but I'm glad some people do. When we finally get our shit together and send people to Mars despite that being a one-way trip, I'm glad there will be volunteers who will sign up for that and go be pioneers. I hope they get a school named after them.
lazide 2y ago
Eh, I’m fairly certain that point was passed many seasons before he finally got eaten. Good point though!
poulpy123 2y ago
I don't say I identify with him but I have some respect and even admiration for McCandless, because I think I understand his feelings from what I've read and watched about him, but I don't have the same feeling for Treadwell though
- toenail 2y ago
  They were both ill-prepared and harmed their environment. Anybody who gets help for their mental health problems deserves more admiration.
  - southernplaces7 2y ago
    To be fair to McCandles, who was generally extremely foolish in what he did too, at least his idiocy and lack of really basic preparation didn't get anyone else killed.
    - EdwardDiego 2y ago
      Yeah, but someone had to handle his corpse. I mean, SAR people can get kinda used to it, but it's still going to ruin your day a little.
      - qup 2y ago
        We should make it illegal to die
        s1artibartfast 2y ago
        Civilized people walk into the incinerator alive.
        xsmasher 2y ago
        I'd rather take my chance at being renewed in carousel than be terminated as a runner.
      - 1234letshaveatw 2y ago
        someone is going to have to handle everyones
      - patrick451 2y ago
verinus 2y ago
Being stupid and selfish should not be celebrated at all but warned against! He did not understand bears, just saw them how he wanted them to be and actually did them a severe disservice! Going outside of you comfort zone is valuable though, but only if done with knowledge of your own limits and consequences! e.g. I live in the Alps and we have much too many stupid tourists' emergencies in the mountains due to ignorance than should be. They know nothing about the mountains, the tour, how weather is up there, what equipment and clothing to bring and wear and completely disregard advice of locals. Then Mountain Rescue risk their lives and health to get them down. Most of them volunteers no less!
- jklinger410 2y ago
  > and actually did them a severe disservice! I can't imagine what disservice was done. A guy hung around bears for a while, and one ate him and his girlfriend. To the bears literally nothing happened of note.
  - tuna74 2y ago
    Two of the bears that ate him and his girlfriend got killed.
  - Marinus 2y ago
    Had you read the article, you would have known that two bears were put down, as a direct result of all this.
  - baseballdork 2y ago
    The bears were shot and killed.
  - d1sxeyes 2y ago
    Reputation damage
  - MisterTea 2y ago
    > To the bears literally nothing happened of note. They ate an exotic meal.
freddie_mercury 2y ago
>They are trying to experience the world as humans throughout history have experienced the world. Except this isn't really true. Humans throughout history are invariably tribal, not solitary. Their solitary pursuits are in many ways profoundly modern and in keeping with the entire tradition of solipsistic modernity. > these people actually lived in these places and experienced these things in a way the vast majority of modern humanity never will. But...so? The same could be said if they moved to any developing country (I live in a developing country) but nobody is valorising that in the same way.
- 1234letshaveatw 2y ago
  This silly reddit narrative, invented to push a political viewpoint, is utter hogwash. There have always been individuals living a solitary lifestyle- explorers and homesteaders, scouts, traders, hunters and fishermen.
  - jklinger410 2y ago
    And yet humans are absolutely social animals. The science is clear.
    - 1234letshaveatw 2y ago
      What a cute cop out
krisoft 2y ago
> they are willing to go into the unknown But how is it the unknown if anyone with half a brain can predict what will happen to them? > these people actually lived in these places and experienced these things in a way the vast majority of modern humanity never will That is true, but it is not like the only way to experience the wilderness is by being reckless. There is a ton of people enjoying this kind of thing without getting bears killed for no good reason.
- jstanley 2y ago
  Being reckless and going off unprepared is a different type of experience. You can't have the same experience if you come prepared. Yes, you might die, but while you're alive you're really living. I'm quite comfortable living an ordinary comfortable life and preparing in advance for novel experiences, but I'm glad some people throw caution to the wind and chance it. It takes all sorts to make the world.
  - EdwardDiego 2y ago
    > Yes, you might die, but while you're alive you're really living. You're very privileged to be able to think this way. And very naïve. A lot of people in our world spend a lot of time trying not to die, and they don't think, "wow, this is really living" while they're scrabbling for survival. I've been in a few situations where death was close and I don't think "wow, I was really living then". At best I thought "well that fucking sucked", at worst I spent years recovering from PTSD. > Yes, you might die, but while you're alive you're really living. Now this is pod-racing. I'm sorry you feel you've been missing out by living a safe and comfortable life, but you really haven't missed out at all. But shit, just go skydiving or mountaineering, get this weird mindset out of your system.
    - jstanley 2y ago
      There's a big difference between putting yourself in a dangerous situation by choice and being in one out of necessity.
  - 2y ago
deng 2y ago
Except these "Grizzly Men" and Supertramps of the world can only do what they do because society has enabled them to do that. Try living that life without any technology, transportation, modern outdoor equipment, drugs/medications, etc. It's an unproductive and essentially narcissistic way of living, whereas hackers create. This is precisely why Timothy had to build this ridiculous fantasy of him being the protector of these bears, whereas in fact it was him who needed the bears to satisfy his egomania.
- 1234letshaveatw 2y ago
  Meh- people have done without the trappings of modern society, with varying levels of comfort, for thousands of years.
  - deng 2y ago
    Yep, and how did humans survive this? By going out alone into the wilderness? That would be incredibly stupid. You die out there alone. So here's what they did: they formed a group and worked together. You might even call it "society".
    - 1234letshaveatw 2y ago
      That was not always the case, contrary to what you want to believe.
      - deng 2y ago
        Fortunately, you provide some cold hard facts that counter my beliefs.
        1234letshaveatw 2y ago
        nobody is concerned with your beliefs lol
EdwardDiego 2y ago
> every normie Wow, really. Supertramp wasn't "going outside the comfort zone of normies", he was making very bad, very stupid decisions that inflicted suffering on those he loved. Oh, and the people who had to recover his corpse. Yeah, fuck those normies and their "maps" and "bushcraft relevant to their ecosystem", this guy was the real deal huh. No point in learning from others, just wing it and die a pointless needless death. > I think it's worth exploring and celebrating. I feel that this points to a certain existential angst you may be feeling, but please let me assure you that dying alone and scared like these two munters is not the way to resolve it. And for the love of all that's holy, please stop romanticising selfish idiots. The only nice thing I can say about Supertramp is that he didn't directly endanger anyone else, unlike the guy who got his girlfriend eaten by bears.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
sandworm101 2y ago
>> They were real hackers in a way most on this site cannot really comprehend. Oh we all know what this was. It was someone doing something stupid and filming it. He can pretend that he was studying behavior but he broke that mirror when he started interacting with bears. This was someone creating footage in order to market that footage and support his lifestyle, no different than people in wingsuits doing dangerous stunts for clicks. Both were "experts" in the thing they were doing, right up until that thing killed them.
jrm4 2y ago
Upvote, though I'm not a fan of "can't comprehend" But broadly, Nassim Nicholas Taleb's work changed my thinking a bit on when I see people doing brave (and/or perhaps goddamn stupid) stuff like this. Skin in the game is powerful. There is something to be said for -- "as long as you're ONLY putting yourself in harm's way, do your thing." Again, I think playing around with bears is dumb as all hell, but for (an admittedly different) example, I no longer make fun of the Lifelock guy. Went from idiot to hero in my book.
sethammons 2y ago
You ever wonder if your life's purpose is simply to serve as a warning sign for others?
hluska 2y ago
> They are trying to experience the world as humans throughout history have experienced the world. There was a critical difference between these cases. Early humans grew up within nature so they had a lot of skill and knowledge. I loved Into the Wild and thought I identified with Christopher McCandless too. But the way he packed was not conducive with survival. He sadly didn’t know enough to know how much danger he put himself in. There is a lot to mourn and a lot to learn. But there’s really nothing to celebrate - these were complicated people who behaved like they had a death wish. Early humans had a survival wish and while it didn’t always work out, the motivation was different.
HanClinto 2y ago
“It is not the critic who counts..."
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

marcus_holmes 2y ago

I don't identify with it at all, but I'm glad some people do. When we finally get our shit together and send people to Mars despite that being a one-way trip, I'm glad there will be volunteers who will sign up for that and go be pioneers. I hope they get a school named after them.

lazide 2y ago

Eh, I’m fairly certain that point was passed many seasons before he finally got eaten. Good point though!

poulpy123 2y ago

I don't say I identify with him but I have some respect and even admiration for McCandless, because I think I understand his feelings from what I've read and watched about him, but I don't have the same feeling for Treadwell though

toenail 2y ago
They were both ill-prepared and harmed their environment. Anybody who gets help for their mental health problems deserves more admiration.
- southernplaces7 2y ago
  To be fair to McCandles, who was generally extremely foolish in what he did too, at least his idiocy and lack of really basic preparation didn't get anyone else killed.
  - EdwardDiego 2y ago
    Yeah, but someone had to handle his corpse. I mean, SAR people can get kinda used to it, but it's still going to ruin your day a little.
    - qup 2y ago
      We should make it illegal to die
      - s1artibartfast 2y ago
        Civilized people walk into the incinerator alive.
        xsmasher 2y ago
        I'd rather take my chance at being renewed in carousel than be terminated as a runner.
    - 1234letshaveatw 2y ago
      someone is going to have to handle everyones
    - patrick451 2y ago

verinus 2y ago

Being stupid and selfish should not be celebrated at all but warned against! He did not understand bears, just saw them how he wanted them to be and actually did them a severe disservice! Going outside of you comfort zone is valuable though, but only if done with knowledge of your own limits and consequences! e.g. I live in the Alps and we have much too many stupid tourists' emergencies in the mountains due to ignorance than should be. They know nothing about the mountains, the tour, how weather is up there, what equipment and clothing to bring and wear and completely disregard advice of locals. Then Mountain Rescue risk their lives and health to get them down. Most of them volunteers no less!

jklinger410 2y ago
> and actually did them a severe disservice! I can't imagine what disservice was done. A guy hung around bears for a while, and one ate him and his girlfriend. To the bears literally nothing happened of note.
- tuna74 2y ago
  Two of the bears that ate him and his girlfriend got killed.
- Marinus 2y ago
  Had you read the article, you would have known that two bears were put down, as a direct result of all this.
- baseballdork 2y ago
  The bears were shot and killed.
- d1sxeyes 2y ago
  Reputation damage
- MisterTea 2y ago
  > To the bears literally nothing happened of note. They ate an exotic meal.

freddie_mercury 2y ago

>They are trying to experience the world as humans throughout history have experienced the world. Except this isn't really true. Humans throughout history are invariably tribal, not solitary. Their solitary pursuits are in many ways profoundly modern and in keeping with the entire tradition of solipsistic modernity. > these people actually lived in these places and experienced these things in a way the vast majority of modern humanity never will. But...so? The same could be said if they moved to any developing country (I live in a developing country) but nobody is valorising that in the same way.

1234letshaveatw 2y ago
This silly reddit narrative, invented to push a political viewpoint, is utter hogwash. There have always been individuals living a solitary lifestyle- explorers and homesteaders, scouts, traders, hunters and fishermen.
- jklinger410 2y ago
  And yet humans are absolutely social animals. The science is clear.
  - 1234letshaveatw 2y ago
    What a cute cop out

krisoft 2y ago

> they are willing to go into the unknown But how is it the unknown if anyone with half a brain can predict what will happen to them? > these people actually lived in these places and experienced these things in a way the vast majority of modern humanity never will That is true, but it is not like the only way to experience the wilderness is by being reckless. There is a ton of people enjoying this kind of thing without getting bears killed for no good reason.

jstanley 2y ago
Being reckless and going off unprepared is a different type of experience. You can't have the same experience if you come prepared. Yes, you might die, but while you're alive you're really living. I'm quite comfortable living an ordinary comfortable life and preparing in advance for novel experiences, but I'm glad some people throw caution to the wind and chance it. It takes all sorts to make the world.
- EdwardDiego 2y ago
  > Yes, you might die, but while you're alive you're really living. You're very privileged to be able to think this way. And very naïve. A lot of people in our world spend a lot of time trying not to die, and they don't think, "wow, this is really living" while they're scrabbling for survival. I've been in a few situations where death was close and I don't think "wow, I was really living then". At best I thought "well that fucking sucked", at worst I spent years recovering from PTSD. > Yes, you might die, but while you're alive you're really living. Now this is pod-racing. I'm sorry you feel you've been missing out by living a safe and comfortable life, but you really haven't missed out at all. But shit, just go skydiving or mountaineering, get this weird mindset out of your system.
  - jstanley 2y ago
    There's a big difference between putting yourself in a dangerous situation by choice and being in one out of necessity.
- 2y ago

deng 2y ago

Except these "Grizzly Men" and Supertramps of the world can only do what they do because society has enabled them to do that. Try living that life without any technology, transportation, modern outdoor equipment, drugs/medications, etc. It's an unproductive and essentially narcissistic way of living, whereas hackers create. This is precisely why Timothy had to build this ridiculous fantasy of him being the protector of these bears, whereas in fact it was him who needed the bears to satisfy his egomania.

1234letshaveatw 2y ago
Meh- people have done without the trappings of modern society, with varying levels of comfort, for thousands of years.
- deng 2y ago
  Yep, and how did humans survive this? By going out alone into the wilderness? That would be incredibly stupid. You die out there alone. So here's what they did: they formed a group and worked together. You might even call it "society".
  - 1234letshaveatw 2y ago
    That was not always the case, contrary to what you want to believe.
    - deng 2y ago
      Fortunately, you provide some cold hard facts that counter my beliefs.
      - 1234letshaveatw 2y ago
        nobody is concerned with your beliefs lol

EdwardDiego 2y ago

> every normie Wow, really. Supertramp wasn't "going outside the comfort zone of normies", he was making very bad, very stupid decisions that inflicted suffering on those he loved. Oh, and the people who had to recover his corpse. Yeah, fuck those normies and their "maps" and "bushcraft relevant to their ecosystem", this guy was the real deal huh. No point in learning from others, just wing it and die a pointless needless death. > I think it's worth exploring and celebrating. I feel that this points to a certain existential angst you may be feeling, but please let me assure you that dying alone and scared like these two munters is not the way to resolve it. And for the love of all that's holy, please stop romanticising selfish idiots. The only nice thing I can say about Supertramp is that he didn't directly endanger anyone else, unlike the guy who got his girlfriend eaten by bears.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

sandworm101 2y ago

>> They were real hackers in a way most on this site cannot really comprehend. Oh we all know what this was. It was someone doing something stupid and filming it. He can pretend that he was studying behavior but he broke that mirror when he started interacting with bears. This was someone creating footage in order to market that footage and support his lifestyle, no different than people in wingsuits doing dangerous stunts for clicks. Both were "experts" in the thing they were doing, right up until that thing killed them.

jrm4 2y ago

Upvote, though I'm not a fan of "can't comprehend" But broadly, Nassim Nicholas Taleb's work changed my thinking a bit on when I see people doing brave (and/or perhaps goddamn stupid) stuff like this. Skin in the game is powerful. There is something to be said for -- "as long as you're ONLY putting yourself in harm's way, do your thing." Again, I think playing around with bears is dumb as all hell, but for (an admittedly different) example, I no longer make fun of the Lifelock guy. Went from idiot to hero in my book.

sethammons 2y ago

You ever wonder if your life's purpose is simply to serve as a warning sign for others?

hluska 2y ago

> They are trying to experience the world as humans throughout history have experienced the world. There was a critical difference between these cases. Early humans grew up within nature so they had a lot of skill and knowledge. I loved Into the Wild and thought I identified with Christopher McCandless too. But the way he packed was not conducive with survival. He sadly didn’t know enough to know how much danger he put himself in. There is a lot to mourn and a lot to learn. But there’s really nothing to celebrate - these were complicated people who behaved like they had a death wish. Early humans had a survival wish and while it didn’t always work out, the motivation was different.

HanClinto 2y ago

“It is not the critic who counts..."

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]