4 ms·

A better analogy might be airplane fuel and car fuel. Both are gasoline, but a different kind and not really repleacable. Batteries, without a significant tech

A better analogy might be airplane fuel and car fuel. Both are gasoline, but a different kind and not really repleacable. Batteries, without a significant technology improvement, will not work on semi trucks due to weight issues. But they require way less infrastructure to bootstrap, and they are easier and cheaper to maintain, so they are ok to use with consumer vehicles. On the other hand hydrogen is the only green solution that can be feasible with long haul trucks, buses etc - especially the ones running on set routes.

akira2501 2y ago
> with long haul trucks Ironically, this is clearly not a long haul truck, it's a cab over, and the sleeper space is taken by hydrogen storage. This also gives it an unusually long wheel base which is not what you'd typically want in a truck constrained to local operations. > will not work on semi trucks due to weight issues. Two areas where you might make inroads are in the Auxiliary Power Unit. Truck stops could cover parking areas with high mast solar panels, providing shade to the trucks and the pavement, and capturing power in batteries nearby or directly underground. If the APU was electric and had a battery, it could be recharged there, and the truck could get "shore power" from the stop instead of burning diesel all night. The other would be "reefer" trucks, which usually have a small diesel motor, with a separate tank, which runs the compressor to keep the trailer cool. There might be some trade off in replacing that with a battery driven system, again, if it could be conveniently recharged often enough to prevent service outages.
- RunningDroid 2y ago
  > The other would be "reefer" trucks, which usually have a small diesel motor, with a separate tank, which runs the compressor to keep the trailer cool. There might be some trade off in replacing that with a battery driven system, again, if it could be conveniently recharged often enough to prevent service outages. Further complicating electrification is reefer box trucks, which (in my experience) have a belt coming off the engine to power the compressor for the refrigeration system and have the box put on the back by an upfitter or other third party. : the ones I work with have a capacity of 2, 4, and 6 pallets. (gas, gas, and diesel engine, respectively)
  - akira2501 2y ago
    I've never seen those in an OTR configuration or deployed as such. I was thinking more about these[0]. [0]: https://cooling-concepts.com/trailers/53-foot-refrigerated-trailer-single-temp/ https://cooling-concepts.com/trailers/53-foot-refrigerated-t...
bruce511 2y ago
>> A better analogy might be airplane fuel and car fuel. Both are gasoline, but a different kind and not really repleacable Well, if we're gonna get technical... There are 2 kinds of airplane fuel. AvGas (which is basically gasoline with a high octane) and JetA1 (which is basically paraffin.) I'm not sure JetA1 falls under the term 'gasoline' but obviously ymmv there. You can use AvGas in a car, it's the same stuff. AvGas has more kick (more octane) so its not necessarily great for the engine. I worked on an airfield a long time ago, and on occasion AvGas was used on cars (blended with normal gas it's not too bad.) Avgas is used on piston engined planes, JetA1 on jets and turbo-props. JetA1 is just good quality paraffin so can be used wherever paraffin is used.
dzhiurgis 2y ago
New batteries are being tested in China. They are effectively 2x less dense than jet fuel when accounted for turbine losses which started to make them very feasible for 50-100 passenger planes. The weight savings on jets were always to save fuel. When fuel is almost free it doesn't matter that much anymore. All weight savings go towards range.

akira2501 2y ago

> with long haul trucks Ironically, this is clearly not a long haul truck, it's a cab over, and the sleeper space is taken by hydrogen storage. This also gives it an unusually long wheel base which is not what you'd typically want in a truck constrained to local operations. > will not work on semi trucks due to weight issues. Two areas where you might make inroads are in the Auxiliary Power Unit. Truck stops could cover parking areas with high mast solar panels, providing shade to the trucks and the pavement, and capturing power in batteries nearby or directly underground. If the APU was electric and had a battery, it could be recharged there, and the truck could get "shore power" from the stop instead of burning diesel all night. The other would be "reefer" trucks, which usually have a small diesel motor, with a separate tank, which runs the compressor to keep the trailer cool. There might be some trade off in replacing that with a battery driven system, again, if it could be conveniently recharged often enough to prevent service outages.

RunningDroid 2y ago
> The other would be "reefer" trucks, which usually have a small diesel motor, with a separate tank, which runs the compressor to keep the trailer cool. There might be some trade off in replacing that with a battery driven system, again, if it could be conveniently recharged often enough to prevent service outages. Further complicating electrification is reefer box trucks, which (in my experience) have a belt coming off the engine to power the compressor for the refrigeration system and have the box put on the back by an upfitter or other third party. : the ones I work with have a capacity of 2, 4, and 6 pallets. (gas, gas, and diesel engine, respectively)
- akira2501 2y ago
  I've never seen those in an OTR configuration or deployed as such. I was thinking more about these[0]. [0]: https://cooling-concepts.com/trailers/53-foot-refrigerated-trailer-single-temp/ https://cooling-concepts.com/trailers/53-foot-refrigerated-t...

bruce511 2y ago

>> A better analogy might be airplane fuel and car fuel. Both are gasoline, but a different kind and not really repleacable Well, if we're gonna get technical... There are 2 kinds of airplane fuel. AvGas (which is basically gasoline with a high octane) and JetA1 (which is basically paraffin.) I'm not sure JetA1 falls under the term 'gasoline' but obviously ymmv there. You can use AvGas in a car, it's the same stuff. AvGas has more kick (more octane) so its not necessarily great for the engine. I worked on an airfield a long time ago, and on occasion AvGas was used on cars (blended with normal gas it's not too bad.) Avgas is used on piston engined planes, JetA1 on jets and turbo-props. JetA1 is just good quality paraffin so can be used wherever paraffin is used.

dzhiurgis 2y ago

New batteries are being tested in China. They are effectively 2x less dense than jet fuel when accounted for turbine losses which started to make them very feasible for 50-100 passenger planes. The weight savings on jets were always to save fuel. When fuel is almost free it doesn't matter that much anymore. All weight savings go towards range.