4 ms·

> there's also hard upper limits to what you can earn depending on education, and job title. If you live in CA in the us there are hourly jobs and salary jobs.

> there's also hard upper limits to what you can earn depending on education, and job title. If you live in CA in the us there are hourly jobs and salary jobs. Not all salary jobs are the same. Some of them have "exempt" status. If you make less than (70k a year I think) and work more than 40 hours a week they have to pay you over time. SO your a Jr programer at a game studio and they want to work you 100 hours a week. Well if you make 100k a year tough for you on over time. By that same token I can negotiate a stupid high salary as "top talent" in tech. Regardless of what my title or qualifications are. Most of the giant companies in the Vally got to their scale on the backs of a lot of late nights by a lot of people. >> I know for myself that every day I do approximately 1/5th of the total amount of productive work I can do in a week while remaining happy and willing. The answer to this is money. Not another 10k a year, rather the long bet of stock options. It isn't a bet you're making alone either. I can call up people from some of my more early 2000s start up days and they will move mountains if I ask them to. Because we survived those late nights the is a strange bond... The pay off isn't a bit of money or "FIRE" money, it's "fuck you money", it can be stupid!!! Lots of those types (the ones who won the stock options lottery) are still here working (and more than 40 hours a week) because they love the thrill (it's addicting). Now look at China, pushed the same way. Its tech culture is 996. 9am to 9pm 6 days a week. It also is the home of "lying flat" ... so it is trying BOTH directions. In the case of Greece, productivity per worker is appalling low... They not only need more jobs in general they also need more work out of the same folks. Does removing the cap make running a salary startup that is US style expectations viable? IDFK but it would be a step towards that.

topato 2y ago
Trying to understand China's 996 and lying flat movements, and how they coexist, (as someone from California) confuses me greatly. I also keep hearing that there is massive government overreach there, why don't they just squash the lying flat movement before it spreads?
- zer00eyz 2y ago
  > as someone from California IM going to guess that CA, Hacker news resident has you leaning left and affluent. Maybe even a (fellow) Bay Area resident. Lets look a the bay. The tech boom. The bay is covered from Marin to San Jose with money. Tech, Film (Skywalker, Pixar), Wine. That's the gentrified, affluent, peak Bay Area... Outside this one window the Bay Area has a long storied history of being grimy and hard. WWI and WWII ... Spanish flu, a public safety officer shot a man for not wearing a mask. WWII had the Bay Area as a pretty bawdy town. It stayed that way, one of the OG strip joins was (is?) in the Bay Area. Look at the 50's and 60's Hells Angels, Black Panthers (the armed edition), Patty Hearst and the Symbionese Liberation Army, The Altimont Speed Way murder (concert). Jim Jones and the Peoples Temple. Bill Graham has a venue named after him, but the murder around him getting his start is suspect... You get some "fun" fringe thinkers. The Grateful Dead (you don't have to like them) became a roving acid distribution system every summer (wall of sound, Owlsy acid). Burning man is latter day hippies (more gen X than anything else) who wanted to carry on that spirt and optimism. Neither of these groups are "bad" but they aren't the current afluent Bay Area set for sure. All of this is to say that one should not be surprised when "bipping" is a very Bay Area thing to have happen to you, when you see the current "crime" in the Bay Area. You have affluence next to the people who are down trodden, defeated or simply who do not care, who are acting out against the system! In china all the things that happen in the bay would get squashed. Lying Flat (doing the bare minimum) is their version of rebellion. Their 996 set is our tech scene (was, that's shifted somewhat now). The labels, the reactions, are different, are local... but the motivations and the underlying causes are NOT... Those who have a path and those who do not and the gulf between.
  - kelipso 2y ago
    Why so complicated. Lying flat is just quiet quitting. 996 is all the overworking, crunch time shit. How can they possibly coexist in the same country....well, you see, a country consists of more than one person...

topato 2y ago

Trying to understand China's 996 and lying flat movements, and how they coexist, (as someone from California) confuses me greatly. I also keep hearing that there is massive government overreach there, why don't they just squash the lying flat movement before it spreads?

zer00eyz 2y ago
> as someone from California IM going to guess that CA, Hacker news resident has you leaning left and affluent. Maybe even a (fellow) Bay Area resident. Lets look a the bay. The tech boom. The bay is covered from Marin to San Jose with money. Tech, Film (Skywalker, Pixar), Wine. That's the gentrified, affluent, peak Bay Area... Outside this one window the Bay Area has a long storied history of being grimy and hard. WWI and WWII ... Spanish flu, a public safety officer shot a man for not wearing a mask. WWII had the Bay Area as a pretty bawdy town. It stayed that way, one of the OG strip joins was (is?) in the Bay Area. Look at the 50's and 60's Hells Angels, Black Panthers (the armed edition), Patty Hearst and the Symbionese Liberation Army, The Altimont Speed Way murder (concert). Jim Jones and the Peoples Temple. Bill Graham has a venue named after him, but the murder around him getting his start is suspect... You get some "fun" fringe thinkers. The Grateful Dead (you don't have to like them) became a roving acid distribution system every summer (wall of sound, Owlsy acid). Burning man is latter day hippies (more gen X than anything else) who wanted to carry on that spirt and optimism. Neither of these groups are "bad" but they aren't the current afluent Bay Area set for sure. All of this is to say that one should not be surprised when "bipping" is a very Bay Area thing to have happen to you, when you see the current "crime" in the Bay Area. You have affluence next to the people who are down trodden, defeated or simply who do not care, who are acting out against the system! In china all the things that happen in the bay would get squashed. Lying Flat (doing the bare minimum) is their version of rebellion. Their 996 set is our tech scene (was, that's shifted somewhat now). The labels, the reactions, are different, are local... but the motivations and the underlying causes are NOT... Those who have a path and those who do not and the gulf between.
- kelipso 2y ago
  Why so complicated. Lying flat is just quiet quitting. 996 is all the overworking, crunch time shit. How can they possibly coexist in the same country....well, you see, a country consists of more than one person...