3 ms·

They ain't selling enough, with worldwide sales decreasing rapidly [0]. The tractor industry has become commoditized at the lower market segments with Kubota,

They ain't selling enough, with worldwide sales decreasing rapidly [0]. The tractor industry has become commoditized at the lower market segments with Kubota, Kioti, and Mahindra, and the upper market segments are too specialized for John Deere with competitors like CAT. Ik some friends in the drone and agtech industry in the 2010s, and John Deere was already far behind on the innovation front compared to Bayer-Monsanto, Corteva, CAT, Skydio, or DJI on applications like agricultural drones, autonomous farming, CV applications for soil analysis, etc. The answer is simple - innovate (or M&A) or die. [0] - https://www.deere.com/assets/pdfs/common/news/deere-2q24-earnings-release.pdf https://www.deere.com/assets/pdfs/common/news/deere-2q24-ear...

kevin_thibedeau 2y ago
Nice to see their anti-consumer business practices are blowing up in their face. Imagine how well their sales would be if they hadn't made an enemy out of their customer base.
- alephnerd 2y ago
  Their harsh IP stance would have made sense if they were also constantly innovating. They just weren't. You were paying a premium and facing litigation for tinkering with a better branded Kubota. John Deere was also nowhere near as diversified as most competitors locally (CAT) and globally (Kubota), who invested in defense, construction, drones, EVs, chemicals, and other segments.
  - unregistereddev 2y ago
    I'd question a few of your claims. Deere has an entire construction division and it's huge. Deere has had its hands in the defense industry for decades - they sell military gators, guidance systems for predator drones, etc. They've had electric gators and lawn tractors for a few years now (admittedly they're late electrifying their larger equipment). I don't know where your information is from, but it seems patently incorrect.
    - alephnerd 2y ago
      I'm not denying that they don't have all the above, but they are much smaller portions of their business than at CAT, Kubota, Mahindra Group, etc. Just look at the earnings call for CAT [0] versus John Deere [1]. Q1FY25 revenue for CAT in construction was $6.4B compared to $3.21B in John Deere. Q1FY25 revenue for CAT in Energy was $6.7B versus non-existent for John Deere. Ik about the whole "John Deere Operations Center" vision (and imo it is very cool - I knew some of the Blue River guys), but they had to opportunity to acquire Granular and Climate Corporation as well, and consolidate the FMS space. Alternatively, they could spin out the FMS and experimental portion of John Deere away from the more legacy AGCO/Kutoba competitor SKUs to better support profitability and R&D (sort of an HP/HPE kinda situation). My callout about EV and Defense was moreso a jab at Mahindra being an Indian Chaebol that manufactures (crummy) EV cars and (half decent) Israeli ballistic missles, along with CAT's longstanding Power Generator and Military Construction SKUs. [0] - https://s25.q4cdn.com/358376879/files/doc_financials/2024/q1/1Q-2024-Analyst-Slide-Deck_Final-1.pdf https://s25.q4cdn.com/358376879/files/doc_financials/2024/q1... [1] - https://www.deere.com/assets/pdfs/common/news/deere-1q24-earnings-release.pdf https://www.deere.com/assets/pdfs/common/news/deere-1q24-ear...

kevin_thibedeau 2y ago

Nice to see their anti-consumer business practices are blowing up in their face. Imagine how well their sales would be if they hadn't made an enemy out of their customer base.

alephnerd 2y ago
Their harsh IP stance would have made sense if they were also constantly innovating. They just weren't. You were paying a premium and facing litigation for tinkering with a better branded Kubota. John Deere was also nowhere near as diversified as most competitors locally (CAT) and globally (Kubota), who invested in defense, construction, drones, EVs, chemicals, and other segments.
- unregistereddev 2y ago
  I'd question a few of your claims. Deere has an entire construction division and it's huge. Deere has had its hands in the defense industry for decades - they sell military gators, guidance systems for predator drones, etc. They've had electric gators and lawn tractors for a few years now (admittedly they're late electrifying their larger equipment). I don't know where your information is from, but it seems patently incorrect.
  - alephnerd 2y ago
    I'm not denying that they don't have all the above, but they are much smaller portions of their business than at CAT, Kubota, Mahindra Group, etc. Just look at the earnings call for CAT [0] versus John Deere [1]. Q1FY25 revenue for CAT in construction was $6.4B compared to $3.21B in John Deere. Q1FY25 revenue for CAT in Energy was $6.7B versus non-existent for John Deere. Ik about the whole "John Deere Operations Center" vision (and imo it is very cool - I knew some of the Blue River guys), but they had to opportunity to acquire Granular and Climate Corporation as well, and consolidate the FMS space. Alternatively, they could spin out the FMS and experimental portion of John Deere away from the more legacy AGCO/Kutoba competitor SKUs to better support profitability and R&D (sort of an HP/HPE kinda situation). My callout about EV and Defense was moreso a jab at Mahindra being an Indian Chaebol that manufactures (crummy) EV cars and (half decent) Israeli ballistic missles, along with CAT's longstanding Power Generator and Military Construction SKUs. [0] - https://s25.q4cdn.com/358376879/files/doc_financials/2024/q1/1Q-2024-Analyst-Slide-Deck_Final-1.pdf https://s25.q4cdn.com/358376879/files/doc_financials/2024/q1... [1] - https://www.deere.com/assets/pdfs/common/news/deere-1q24-earnings-release.pdf https://www.deere.com/assets/pdfs/common/news/deere-1q24-ear...