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Have they ever defined what 'high speed' means? I well remember travelling to Florida in the nineties when motels offering 'high speed Internet' meant they had

by rmason 2y ago

Have they ever defined what 'high speed' means? I well remember travelling to Florida in the nineties when motels offering 'high speed Internet' meant they had high speed modem dial up in each room. In Japan and China they have trains running in excess 0f 250 mph. In America the only train I know over 100 mph is the Acela which runs from Washington D.C. to New York City. Although they are promising that Acela will go 150 mph sometime in the future. France had trains going over 150 mph in the seventies when I was first there.

gabruoy 2y ago
Yes. In fact California defining how fast their high speed rail must go is part of what put them in their current situation because they aimed too high when no one in the USA has ever built anything like what they are trying to do. In their own legislation for the project the train must have a top speed of over 200 miles per hour and must go from LA to San Fransisco in 2 hours and 40 minutes, which necessitates an average speed of over 150 miles per hour.
- ac29 2y ago
  If they went with a more modest goal of 250kph (155mph) maximum speed (Class I HSR), it almost certainly would have been easier and cheaper to build. The problem with that is that the Bay Area -> LA times would have been 4+ hours which would have been a pretty hard sell vs flying or even driving.
shiroiushi 2y ago
I'm sorry, but most of what you wrote here is wrong. First, Japan doesn't have any (operational) trains going 250mph. The Tokaido shinkansen between Tokyo and Osaka has a top speed of 300kph, which is 186mph. The Tohoku line in north Japan reaches 320kph (200mph) according to Wikipedia, and this seems to be the fastest in the country (I haven't ridden that one myself, but I have ridden the Tokaido multipel times and verified its speed with a GPS speedometer app.). The new maglev Chuo shinkansen, when it's open for service in 10 years, will go 505kph (314mph). China does have some maglev train currently; I can't be bothered to look up its max speed, but it's a short line that just goes to that city's airport. It's not a long-distance train line, really more of a demo. America has at least 2 trains that go over 100mph: the Acela, which runs from DC to Boston (not NYC), and the Northeast Regional, which runs on the same route on the same tracks. The Northeast Regional hits a max speed of 125mph, and the Acela hits 150mph. The catch is, these trains only hit their max speeds for somewhat brief durations on certain parts of the line (mainly between Philly and Newark NJ), so their average speeds are actually rather lousy because in other places they have to slow down a lot because the track sucks, the tunnels are a century old, there's a cargo train in the way, etc. If the US built an all-new track (with new tunnels where needed) between DC and Boston, they could use the exact same trains they use now and have much, much faster average speeds, but they really don't want to do that. Finally, there is a definition in the US for "high speed rail", and the Acela meets that definition because its max speed is pretty high. (Of course, the definition completely ignores average speed.)
- aednichols 2y ago
  Amtrak reaches 110 mph in a few places in diesel territory (outside of the NEC). The Empire Service and Lincoln Service, for example.
  - deleted 2y ago
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by rmason 2y ago

gabruoy 2y ago

Yes. In fact California defining how fast their high speed rail must go is part of what put them in their current situation because they aimed too high when no one in the USA has ever built anything like what they are trying to do. In their own legislation for the project the train must have a top speed of over 200 miles per hour and must go from LA to San Fransisco in 2 hours and 40 minutes, which necessitates an average speed of over 150 miles per hour.

ac29 2y ago
If they went with a more modest goal of 250kph (155mph) maximum speed (Class I HSR), it almost certainly would have been easier and cheaper to build. The problem with that is that the Bay Area -> LA times would have been 4+ hours which would have been a pretty hard sell vs flying or even driving.

shiroiushi 2y ago

I'm sorry, but most of what you wrote here is wrong. First, Japan doesn't have any (operational) trains going 250mph. The Tokaido shinkansen between Tokyo and Osaka has a top speed of 300kph, which is 186mph. The Tohoku line in north Japan reaches 320kph (200mph) according to Wikipedia, and this seems to be the fastest in the country (I haven't ridden that one myself, but I have ridden the Tokaido multipel times and verified its speed with a GPS speedometer app.). The new maglev Chuo shinkansen, when it's open for service in 10 years, will go 505kph (314mph). China does have some maglev train currently; I can't be bothered to look up its max speed, but it's a short line that just goes to that city's airport. It's not a long-distance train line, really more of a demo. America has at least 2 trains that go over 100mph: the Acela, which runs from DC to Boston (not NYC), and the Northeast Regional, which runs on the same route on the same tracks. The Northeast Regional hits a max speed of 125mph, and the Acela hits 150mph. The catch is, these trains only hit their max speeds for somewhat brief durations on certain parts of the line (mainly between Philly and Newark NJ), so their average speeds are actually rather lousy because in other places they have to slow down a lot because the track sucks, the tunnels are a century old, there's a cargo train in the way, etc. If the US built an all-new track (with new tunnels where needed) between DC and Boston, they could use the exact same trains they use now and have much, much faster average speeds, but they really don't want to do that. Finally, there is a definition in the US for "high speed rail", and the Acela meets that definition because its max speed is pretty high. (Of course, the definition completely ignores average speed.)

aednichols 2y ago
Amtrak reaches 110 mph in a few places in diesel territory (outside of the NEC). The Empire Service and Lincoln Service, for example.
- deleted 2y ago
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