9 ms·

Unless you have a lot of flexibility in terms of where you work, this type of advice is becoming less relevant in an IT job market that's in free fall. Much fe

by oblio 2y ago

Unless you have a lot of flexibility in terms of where you work, this type of advice is becoming less relevant in an IT job market that's in free fall. Much fewer devs can just jump ship at will than between 2003 - 2022.

jononor 2y ago
Don't just jump ship. But do actively look for better opportunities if you are not satisfied where you are.
999900000999 2y ago
In my situation it would have been much easier to just keep my head down until I was able to get another job. I ended up causing a lot of tension at work, the engineer who had wrote this code openly resented me . Usually when people are putting broken code into the code base it's a wider cultural problem, that you're not realistically going to solve.
mostlysimilar 2y ago
> Unless you have a lot of flexibility in terms of where you work, this type of advice is becoming less relevant in an IT job market that's in free fall. > Much fewer devs can just jump ship at will than between 2003 - 2022. Citation needed. Good developers are just as in demand now as they have ever been.
- icedchai 2y ago
  It's supply and demand. Demand is lower (less jobs.) Supply is higher (more layoffs, people looking for work.) Even if you are "good", there's a lot of other "good" people looking, too. Some even may be better than you! Or at least better at marketing themselves.
  - dandrew5 2y ago
    Marketing yourself is more important now than ever. The advent of AI has created a noise problem at the hiring level on both sides: applicants are leveraging tools to generate necessary documents (targeted resumes, cover letters, social profiles), recruiters are using scanning tools to weed out anything that doesn't contain the magical keywords or phrases.
- lolinder 2y ago
  The demand might be there, but if you have a proven way to get recognized as a "good developer" during the hiring process I'd love to hear it.
  - rowanG077 2y ago
    References. Ask the good devs you have for someone good they know.
    - oblio 2y ago
      None of the FAANGs or even tier 2 companies work on references, unless you invented the internet or something. And even then, there is a famous story of the dev of the popular MacOS FOSS package manager, Homebrew, failing his interview at Apple.
      - rowanG077 2y ago
        I don't get the point why a maintainer of a popular package failed his interview. Having a popular package has nothing to do with coding ability and much more to do with writing the right thing at the right time.
        oblio 2y ago
        He wasn't the "maintainer of a popular package". He was the creator/designer and main dev of Homebrew, the OSS <<package manager>> almost every dev on MacOS uses. He took an idea to completion, made it production ready and used by probably millions of users. I don't care about raw coding ability (Carmack style), if building such a large project doesn't prove at least development abilities, nothing does.
    - andyjohnson0 2y ago
      I think the parent commenter was asking from the point of view of a person looking to be employed, not a business or hiring manager looking for devs.
    - 2y ago
- ransom1538 2y ago
  "Good developers are just as in demand now as they have ever been." Citation needed.
- seadan83 2y ago
  Hard to compare the time period. I'm still coming to grips what it means when 95% of jobs I apply to are remote. There are other data points to consider: - higher interest rates and less VC money equates to less startups and less hiring - large tech layoffs To your point of demand for 'good' developers - I suspect that is likely true. I don't know how to decouple that from the problem of interviews not able to identify good developers. A 'good' developer is a function of the individual, what is happening in their life, the team, the codebase, leadership, process, tech debt, etc..
kccqzy 2y ago
The market is not in a free fall. Or rather, it's only a free fall for junior fresh-out-of-college developers. If you are skilled and senior, don't believe this nonsense and have confidence in yourself. This is just an extension of the imposter syndrome that I see often in many people.
- oblio 2y ago
  If you are skilled and senior about 2 years back you'd compete with 5-10 other qualified candidates. Now it's 100+.
- maxrecursion 2y ago
  This is exactly it. The entry level market is getting more and more over saturated. It is bleeding upwards to mid level slowly. But if you are a skilled senior you are still in high demand. If not your resume probably sucks or you are not as skilled as most seniors.
mlhpdx 2y ago
Define “free fall”, please. There seem to be plenty of interesting openings as far as I can tell. Less hysterical hiring, but plenty of work (and more interesting than the endless CRUD of 15 years ago).

by oblio 2y ago

jononor 2y ago

Don't just jump ship. But do actively look for better opportunities if you are not satisfied where you are.

999900000999 2y ago

In my situation it would have been much easier to just keep my head down until I was able to get another job. I ended up causing a lot of tension at work, the engineer who had wrote this code openly resented me . Usually when people are putting broken code into the code base it's a wider cultural problem, that you're not realistically going to solve.

mostlysimilar 2y ago

> Unless you have a lot of flexibility in terms of where you work, this type of advice is becoming less relevant in an IT job market that's in free fall. > Much fewer devs can just jump ship at will than between 2003 - 2022. Citation needed. Good developers are just as in demand now as they have ever been.

icedchai 2y ago
It's supply and demand. Demand is lower (less jobs.) Supply is higher (more layoffs, people looking for work.) Even if you are "good", there's a lot of other "good" people looking, too. Some even may be better than you! Or at least better at marketing themselves.
- dandrew5 2y ago
  Marketing yourself is more important now than ever. The advent of AI has created a noise problem at the hiring level on both sides: applicants are leveraging tools to generate necessary documents (targeted resumes, cover letters, social profiles), recruiters are using scanning tools to weed out anything that doesn't contain the magical keywords or phrases.
lolinder 2y ago
The demand might be there, but if you have a proven way to get recognized as a "good developer" during the hiring process I'd love to hear it.
- rowanG077 2y ago
  References. Ask the good devs you have for someone good they know.
  - oblio 2y ago
    None of the FAANGs or even tier 2 companies work on references, unless you invented the internet or something. And even then, there is a famous story of the dev of the popular MacOS FOSS package manager, Homebrew, failing his interview at Apple.
    - rowanG077 2y ago
      I don't get the point why a maintainer of a popular package failed his interview. Having a popular package has nothing to do with coding ability and much more to do with writing the right thing at the right time.
      - oblio 2y ago
        He wasn't the "maintainer of a popular package". He was the creator/designer and main dev of Homebrew, the OSS <<package manager>> almost every dev on MacOS uses. He took an idea to completion, made it production ready and used by probably millions of users. I don't care about raw coding ability (Carmack style), if building such a large project doesn't prove at least development abilities, nothing does.
  - andyjohnson0 2y ago
    I think the parent commenter was asking from the point of view of a person looking to be employed, not a business or hiring manager looking for devs.
  - 2y ago
ransom1538 2y ago
"Good developers are just as in demand now as they have ever been." Citation needed.
seadan83 2y ago
Hard to compare the time period. I'm still coming to grips what it means when 95% of jobs I apply to are remote. There are other data points to consider: - higher interest rates and less VC money equates to less startups and less hiring - large tech layoffs To your point of demand for 'good' developers - I suspect that is likely true. I don't know how to decouple that from the problem of interviews not able to identify good developers. A 'good' developer is a function of the individual, what is happening in their life, the team, the codebase, leadership, process, tech debt, etc..

kccqzy 2y ago

The market is not in a free fall. Or rather, it's only a free fall for junior fresh-out-of-college developers. If you are skilled and senior, don't believe this nonsense and have confidence in yourself. This is just an extension of the imposter syndrome that I see often in many people.

oblio 2y ago
If you are skilled and senior about 2 years back you'd compete with 5-10 other qualified candidates. Now it's 100+.
maxrecursion 2y ago
This is exactly it. The entry level market is getting more and more over saturated. It is bleeding upwards to mid level slowly. But if you are a skilled senior you are still in high demand. If not your resume probably sucks or you are not as skilled as most seniors.

mlhpdx 2y ago

Define “free fall”, please. There seem to be plenty of interesting openings as far as I can tell. Less hysterical hiring, but plenty of work (and more interesting than the endless CRUD of 15 years ago).