3 ms·

> I'd like dying to be as easy as flicking a switch. It is. Just flick the blade open on a switchblade and stab into your temple. You don't need a fricking sec

> I'd like dying to be as easy as flicking a switch. It is. Just flick the blade open on a switchblade and stab into your temple. You don't need a fricking second or third party to help you with this. Some of us atheists view life as more precious than many religious people do because this is it.

delta_p_delta_x 2y ago
> stab > fricking Do you really have to be so violent in response? There exist supervised injection sites for narcotics. You bring the drugs, the healthcare workers give you clean syringes/needles/paraphernalia and help you with the injection. As a society we have decided that it is OK for people to potentially wreck their own lives with narcotics. Why not a similar concept for dying, where the end is only eternal oblivion? Step into a room, step inside a pod, press a button, pod closes, press another button to replace the air with nitrogen, done. > life as more precious I'm sorry, but 'life is precious' is a religious view, even if you call yourself 'atheist'. Life is just life, it is an emergent property of chemical and physical processes and laws. It is interesting, to be sure, but precious? Sorry, no. Humans have killed each other since they evolved from Australopithecus, and have only found more efficient, violent, and deadly ways to do so in the intervening five million years.
- anonymouskimmer 2y ago
  > Do you really have to be so violent in response? I was trying to meet your request for an option that came as close as possible to just flicking a switch. > Step into a room, step inside a pod, press a button, pod closes, press another button to replace the air with nitrogen, done. I know of a friend of a friend who did this on his own. If you are of sufficient capacity to step into some place and press a button then you are able to buy or make this equipment on your own and do it yourself. > I'm sorry, but 'life is precious' is a religious view, even if you call yourself 'atheist'. And some religious people also believe that taking care of Earth's natural environment is also a religious duty. That doesn't make it a religious view, it makes it a general moral view that is shared between some religions and some atheists. The justification for a moral view is what makes it religious or secular. > Humans have killed each other since they evolved from Australopithecus And how many of these deaths have been because of religious beliefs? I think enough of them to say that killing people for moral reasons is a religious view, even if you call yourself 'atheist'.
  - LorenPechtel 2y ago
    No. The tank that can hold enough nitrogen (or helium or argon--same volume means the same pressure which means effectively the same weight) to do the job reliably is heavy. By the time your health is such that you would choose that path you likely can't lift it. I have seen my wife struggle with lifting that weight when it's in a form meant to be lifted. I've seen her fail when it wasn't as cooperative.
    - celdon25 2y ago
      Too bad, I guess that leaves out the "use disproportionately large amounts of the agent to hotbox the room" method. But that doesn't invalidate the point of the parent comment.
      - LorenPechtel 2y ago
        Which is completely missing the point. To hotbox a room you need a bunch of the big cylinders. Look at the tare weights on page 3: https://www.airgas.com/medias/Airgas-Compressed-Gas-Cylinders-MCM-552.pdf https://www.airgas.com/medias/Airgas-Compressed-Gas-Cylinder... The have a volume in cubic feet specified, multiply by the 165 bar that's what's typically used to see how much space it will fill. Looking around our house there's a very odd-shaped closet under the stairs that would be difficult to measure. Of the more typical places the smallest room in the house is a closet. 6' x 5' (minus a 1' x 1' chunk that I believe contains an air duct) x 8' = 232 cubic feet. Suppose you dump 232 cubic feet of material into it--you'll displace half the air which gives a time of useful consciousness of 20-30 minutes. Not good enough. Let's try doubling that, now we end up with a time of useful consciousness of 30-60 seconds. That's probably enough. That's 2 cylinders at 137 pounds each. Or if you use aluminum, 3 cylinders of 90 pounds each.
        celdon25 2y ago
        Yeah, nobody is seriously suggesting to do that. It was an example for the sake of argument.
    - 2y ago
- bowsamic 2y ago
  Why are you against religious views?
  - delta_p_delta_x 2y ago
    I think religion has done more harm to humanity as a whole than anything else, and none more so than the two most popular monotheistic, evangelical, 'convert or die' religions. Religion is a vehicle to power, and I dislike it. There are of course some very positive side effects like beautiful architecture and music, and plenty of philosophical debate, but I wish it came without the baggage. But then again, I feel the two Abrahamic religions are philosophically scarce—can't have debate when everyone who disagrees with you is killed or converted.
    - anonymouskimmer 2y ago
      > the two Abrahamic religions It's three main ones (Judaism, Christianity, Islam) and a bunch of off-shoots such as Samaritanism, Mormonism, Baháʼí. I'm opposed to religious philosophies in as much as non-real/provable beliefs, and feelings based on these non-provable beliefs, are used as justification for the philosophy or moral stance.

delta_p_delta_x 2y ago

> stab > fricking Do you really have to be so violent in response? There exist supervised injection sites for narcotics. You bring the drugs, the healthcare workers give you clean syringes/needles/paraphernalia and help you with the injection. As a society we have decided that it is OK for people to potentially wreck their own lives with narcotics. Why not a similar concept for dying, where the end is only eternal oblivion? Step into a room, step inside a pod, press a button, pod closes, press another button to replace the air with nitrogen, done. > life as more precious I'm sorry, but 'life is precious' is a religious view, even if you call yourself 'atheist'. Life is just life, it is an emergent property of chemical and physical processes and laws. It is interesting, to be sure, but precious? Sorry, no. Humans have killed each other since they evolved from Australopithecus, and have only found more efficient, violent, and deadly ways to do so in the intervening five million years.

anonymouskimmer 2y ago
> Do you really have to be so violent in response? I was trying to meet your request for an option that came as close as possible to just flicking a switch. > Step into a room, step inside a pod, press a button, pod closes, press another button to replace the air with nitrogen, done. I know of a friend of a friend who did this on his own. If you are of sufficient capacity to step into some place and press a button then you are able to buy or make this equipment on your own and do it yourself. > I'm sorry, but 'life is precious' is a religious view, even if you call yourself 'atheist'. And some religious people also believe that taking care of Earth's natural environment is also a religious duty. That doesn't make it a religious view, it makes it a general moral view that is shared between some religions and some atheists. The justification for a moral view is what makes it religious or secular. > Humans have killed each other since they evolved from Australopithecus And how many of these deaths have been because of religious beliefs? I think enough of them to say that killing people for moral reasons is a religious view, even if you call yourself 'atheist'.
- LorenPechtel 2y ago
  No. The tank that can hold enough nitrogen (or helium or argon--same volume means the same pressure which means effectively the same weight) to do the job reliably is heavy. By the time your health is such that you would choose that path you likely can't lift it. I have seen my wife struggle with lifting that weight when it's in a form meant to be lifted. I've seen her fail when it wasn't as cooperative.
  - celdon25 2y ago
    Too bad, I guess that leaves out the "use disproportionately large amounts of the agent to hotbox the room" method. But that doesn't invalidate the point of the parent comment.
    - LorenPechtel 2y ago
      Which is completely missing the point. To hotbox a room you need a bunch of the big cylinders. Look at the tare weights on page 3: https://www.airgas.com/medias/Airgas-Compressed-Gas-Cylinders-MCM-552.pdf https://www.airgas.com/medias/Airgas-Compressed-Gas-Cylinder... The have a volume in cubic feet specified, multiply by the 165 bar that's what's typically used to see how much space it will fill. Looking around our house there's a very odd-shaped closet under the stairs that would be difficult to measure. Of the more typical places the smallest room in the house is a closet. 6' x 5' (minus a 1' x 1' chunk that I believe contains an air duct) x 8' = 232 cubic feet. Suppose you dump 232 cubic feet of material into it--you'll displace half the air which gives a time of useful consciousness of 20-30 minutes. Not good enough. Let's try doubling that, now we end up with a time of useful consciousness of 30-60 seconds. That's probably enough. That's 2 cylinders at 137 pounds each. Or if you use aluminum, 3 cylinders of 90 pounds each.
      - celdon25 2y ago
        Yeah, nobody is seriously suggesting to do that. It was an example for the sake of argument.
  - 2y ago
bowsamic 2y ago
Why are you against religious views?
- delta_p_delta_x 2y ago
  I think religion has done more harm to humanity as a whole than anything else, and none more so than the two most popular monotheistic, evangelical, 'convert or die' religions. Religion is a vehicle to power, and I dislike it. There are of course some very positive side effects like beautiful architecture and music, and plenty of philosophical debate, but I wish it came without the baggage. But then again, I feel the two Abrahamic religions are philosophically scarce—can't have debate when everyone who disagrees with you is killed or converted.
  - anonymouskimmer 2y ago
    > the two Abrahamic religions It's three main ones (Judaism, Christianity, Islam) and a bunch of off-shoots such as Samaritanism, Mormonism, Baháʼí. I'm opposed to religious philosophies in as much as non-real/provable beliefs, and feelings based on these non-provable beliefs, are used as justification for the philosophy or moral stance.