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Is this considered a controversial point? I would have thought that most people would have thought the same thing. it's really been amazing to see how Bill Ga

Is this considered a controversial point? I would have thought that most people would have thought the same thing. it's really been amazing to see how Bill Gates reputation has rebounded in tech forums in the past 5 years. 5 years ago it would be the rule rather than the exception for Bill to be bad mouthed in tech forums. Now I've noticed that it's mostly the opposite. My guess is that in 50 years Bill Gates will be more remembered because his achievements will seem alot more amazing that Steve Job's. Bill will be remembered as the guy who put a computer in every house and then went on to save billions of people. In 50 years Apple may no longer even exist, it will be much harder for people to remember Jobs as the guy who saved apple and help make computer animated films popular.

cremnob 14y ago
It's controversial among tech geeks (but that shouldn't be surprising considering the PC vs Mac fanboyism) but really this article is just linkbait.
firefoxman1 14y ago
It's just like how Carnegie wasn't spoken of very well until later in his life, after he became a philanthropist. On the other hand, Fred Harvey (a very Jobs-like entrepreneur and a hero of mine) is remembered by very few. I'm sure you could find dozens of other examples throughout recent history, but the thing I've noticed is that the true heroes don't care if they're remembered; they're content in knowing they made a meaningful contribution to humanity.
- rprasad 14y ago
  Eradiacting a disease that has killed millions...that is a meaningful contribution to society. Helping fund massive innovation in the education system...that is a meaningful contribution to society. Selling electronics gadgets for a lot of money is not a meaningful contribution to society.
  - jerf 14y ago
    Education system reform in any sense that an HN'er would generally conceive of is first going to be built upon a foundation of selling lots of cheap electronic gadgets for what still comes to a lot of money. Are you sure it's not a meaningful contribution to society? If electronic gadgets are extensions of our minds, are you sure it's not a meaningful contribution to work out how to make them do more, more cheaply, for more people, until the utility of the devices is so great that it overcomes nearly everyone's reluctance to part with their money? The picture is not so clear cut as that. Every leaf node on the tree of human accomplishment nowadays is built upon an awful lot of other less glamorous nodes, but take them away and the glamorous stuff doesn't happen. You may not understand how the sewer worker contributes to the cancer cure, until the sewer worker stops showing up for work on the cancer research facility's beat, at which point your nose may explain it to you.
  - deleted 14y ago
    [deleted]
  - pbreit 14y ago
    It's easily conceivable that Apple products will have a significantly larger positive impact on education and healthcare than anything the Gates Foundation does. And I think it is pathetic to insinuate that Apple products are not a "meaningful contribution to society".
pbreit 14y ago
Not only is it controversial but it's probably wrong. Bill Gates hardly comes up in conversation anymore and Microsoft's relevance is way less than a company of its revenues, product usage and stature should be. I couldn't even name a single thing the Gates Foundation is doing, much less has accomplished. No one will remember desktop computers in 50 years when computing will be all around us (moved ever so far forward by Apple products). Your last sentence is drastically understating the impact Jobs had on multiple massive industries.
- rapind 14y ago
  You can't name a single thing the Gates Foundation is doing simply because you aren't benefiting from it. You're not one of the million people dying each year from malaria, or part of the population likely to be infected. Beating it, which seems like a possibility, could be a pretty big deal all things considered. I don't think either will be a household name in 50 years, but if I had to bet then I'd give Gates the edge.
- eaurouge 14y ago
  You can't name a single thing the Gates Foundation has done because you're uninformed and, unfortunately, don't seem to see anything wrong with that.
  - pbreit 14y ago
    Well, I would consider myself pretty well-informed. But, no, I did not have the Gates Foundation's education and malaria funding top-of-mind. And after some brief research am still not quite sure what the money is going towards and if it is accomplishing much.
    - eaurouge 14y ago
      The Gates Foundation has arguably had more impact on human welfare than any other private organization in history, and yet is still in its early stages. So when you say you know nothing of this work, it suggests a lack of awareness of, and lack of curiosity in, global matters. And after some brief research am still not quite sure what the money is going towards and if it is accomplishing much. When you follow up with this, it suggests that either your "brief research" was too brief or your research skills are poor. Now perhaps you've said all this to make a point, but that's not how it comes across.
scorpion032 14y ago
> "You know, we don’t grow most of the food we eat. We wear clothes other people make. We speak a language that other people developed. We use a mathematics that other people evolved… I mean, we’re constantly taking things. It’s a wonderful, ecstatic feeling to create something that puts it back in the pool of human experience and knowledge" - Steve Jobs Ones contribution to the world need not necessarily be in the form of money; but very well in the form of experience or knowledge.

cremnob 14y ago

It's controversial among tech geeks (but that shouldn't be surprising considering the PC vs Mac fanboyism) but really this article is just linkbait.

firefoxman1 14y ago

It's just like how Carnegie wasn't spoken of very well until later in his life, after he became a philanthropist. On the other hand, Fred Harvey (a very Jobs-like entrepreneur and a hero of mine) is remembered by very few. I'm sure you could find dozens of other examples throughout recent history, but the thing I've noticed is that the true heroes don't care if they're remembered; they're content in knowing they made a meaningful contribution to humanity.

rprasad 14y ago
Eradiacting a disease that has killed millions...that is a meaningful contribution to society. Helping fund massive innovation in the education system...that is a meaningful contribution to society. Selling electronics gadgets for a lot of money is not a meaningful contribution to society.
- jerf 14y ago
  Education system reform in any sense that an HN'er would generally conceive of is first going to be built upon a foundation of selling lots of cheap electronic gadgets for what still comes to a lot of money. Are you sure it's not a meaningful contribution to society? If electronic gadgets are extensions of our minds, are you sure it's not a meaningful contribution to work out how to make them do more, more cheaply, for more people, until the utility of the devices is so great that it overcomes nearly everyone's reluctance to part with their money? The picture is not so clear cut as that. Every leaf node on the tree of human accomplishment nowadays is built upon an awful lot of other less glamorous nodes, but take them away and the glamorous stuff doesn't happen. You may not understand how the sewer worker contributes to the cancer cure, until the sewer worker stops showing up for work on the cancer research facility's beat, at which point your nose may explain it to you.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
- pbreit 14y ago
  It's easily conceivable that Apple products will have a significantly larger positive impact on education and healthcare than anything the Gates Foundation does. And I think it is pathetic to insinuate that Apple products are not a "meaningful contribution to society".

pbreit 14y ago

Not only is it controversial but it's probably wrong. Bill Gates hardly comes up in conversation anymore and Microsoft's relevance is way less than a company of its revenues, product usage and stature should be. I couldn't even name a single thing the Gates Foundation is doing, much less has accomplished. No one will remember desktop computers in 50 years when computing will be all around us (moved ever so far forward by Apple products). Your last sentence is drastically understating the impact Jobs had on multiple massive industries.

rapind 14y ago
You can't name a single thing the Gates Foundation is doing simply because you aren't benefiting from it. You're not one of the million people dying each year from malaria, or part of the population likely to be infected. Beating it, which seems like a possibility, could be a pretty big deal all things considered. I don't think either will be a household name in 50 years, but if I had to bet then I'd give Gates the edge.
eaurouge 14y ago
You can't name a single thing the Gates Foundation has done because you're uninformed and, unfortunately, don't seem to see anything wrong with that.
- pbreit 14y ago
  Well, I would consider myself pretty well-informed. But, no, I did not have the Gates Foundation's education and malaria funding top-of-mind. And after some brief research am still not quite sure what the money is going towards and if it is accomplishing much.
  - eaurouge 14y ago
    The Gates Foundation has arguably had more impact on human welfare than any other private organization in history, and yet is still in its early stages. So when you say you know nothing of this work, it suggests a lack of awareness of, and lack of curiosity in, global matters. And after some brief research am still not quite sure what the money is going towards and if it is accomplishing much. When you follow up with this, it suggests that either your "brief research" was too brief or your research skills are poor. Now perhaps you've said all this to make a point, but that's not how it comes across.

scorpion032 14y ago

> "You know, we don’t grow most of the food we eat. We wear clothes other people make. We speak a language that other people developed. We use a mathematics that other people evolved… I mean, we’re constantly taking things. It’s a wonderful, ecstatic feeling to create something that puts it back in the pool of human experience and knowledge" - Steve Jobs Ones contribution to the world need not necessarily be in the form of money; but very well in the form of experience or knowledge.