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Unfortunately by the time this detects a piece of ivory, the damage is already done. If it took 3 years to inject 20 rhinos, it's unlikely that a large enough p
by jjk166 2y ago
Unfortunately by the time this detects a piece of ivory, the damage is already done. If it took 3 years to inject 20 rhinos, it's unlikely that a large enough portion of the population could be injected to act as an effective deterrent for those actually killing the animals. Even for those actually involved in moving the ivory, it's only a deterrent if they actually face consequences at these borders - many states have weak enforcement of anti-ivory laws, and many more have bribable customs agents. Further, ivory has a value to weight ratio that is extremely conducive to smuggling.
By comparison, infusion which puts a dye and an anti-consumption toxin in the horns to render the ivory worthless and thus prevent the animals from being killed in the first place is a well developed and inexpensive process that has proven effective.[0] I don't see how radioisotope injection is an improvement.
[0] https://rhinorescueproject.org/how-it-works/ https://rhinorescueproject.org/how-it-works/
- philipwhiuk 2y agoAlso.. Geiger counters are not expensive and they can just ignore the tiny fraction of injected rhinos.
- alan-hn 2y agoI'm not sure that it would be detectable with a Geiger counter. Other chemical analysis methods are used to detect isotopes like this
- 4gotunameagain 2y agoThey say that the plan is to use existing radiation detectors at ports. Another article [1] mentions that the isotope emits Gamma rays, one of the types of radiation that can be detected by a Geiger - Muller tube. [1] https://www.extremetech.com/science/scientists-turn-to-radioactive-isotopes-in-the-fight-against-rhino-poaching https://www.extremetech.com/science/scientists-turn-to-radio...
- jjk166 2y agoAccording to the article, the radioisotope is specifically meant to be detected by the handheld radiation detectors typically used by customs agents. If it can't be detected by passive radiation detectors, there is even less argument for its efficacy.
- Sanzig 2y agoThe flux follows the inverse square law, however, which means to detect if a rhino is tagged you'd have to get really close. Admittedly I don't know anything about the mechanics of rhino poaching, but considering how aggressive rhinos are I imagine poachers would prefer to shoot them from a decent range for their own safety.
- jjk166 2y agoNo one is talking about scanning live rhinos. Even in the best case scenario, this is to catch poachers long after the rhinos are dead.
- dotancohen 2y agoThey'll kill the rhino, then test it. If it tests positive, they'll just leave the carcass to rot.
- jjk166 2y agoNo one is talking about testing live rhinos. Even in the best case scenario this is to catch poachers after the rhino is dead.
- zozo-whywhy 2y agoSo you're saying... it's a good idea, there's hope, and that they should do it.
- Muromec 2y agoWell maybe radioactivity should trip existing detectors in airports and customs? I’m not sure those exist, but sounds like something you want to scan for on the borderline
- jjk166 2y agoWhen I say smuggling here, I mean crossing a border illegally, avoiding customs.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- BurningFrog 2y ago> Unfortunately by the time this detects a piece of ivory, the damage is already done Reminds me of one of the worst "abolish the Police" arguments: By the time you put a murderer in jail, the victim is already dead.
- DistantCl3ric 2y agoRhino horn is not ivory. Its keratin. Higher value to weight ratio than ivory.
- __MatrixMan__ 2y agoGotta wonder if it would be better to instead focus on making it easier to source keratin from a bioreactor / cell culture. Crash the market with "counterfeit" rhino keratin which is as good as the real stuff anyhow.
- williamdclt 2y agoI'd guess that most buyers of objects made from rhino horns are more interested in its rhino horn nature than its keratin composition. If keratin became suddenly abundant, I doubt it'd impact the rhino horn market very much I know nothing of that market though, could be entirely wrong
- __MatrixMan__ 2y agoI also know nothing of it, it's just a fun thought. In a previous life I really enjoyed faking parking permits and IDs and transcripts and stuff... it would be pretty fun to return to that but this time be one of the good guys: faking rhino horns for the sake of protecting actual rhinos.
- michael1999 2y agoBut good counterfeits would crash the market. It’s already run by crooks. They’d be happy to cheat.
- IncreasePosts 2y agoThen rich Chinese dudes who can't get a boner will demand a video of their rhino being killed and the horn being taken.
- StormChaser_5 2y ago
- wanderingstan 2y agoThis is a proof of concept project. The “3 years” is not because of some inherent difficulty, it’s just a typical research project. From the article: > …will closely monitor the health and vital statistics of the rhinos over a period of six months, in order to determine the viability of this approach. If this approach is shown to be healthy, I’m sure it could be done much faster.
- godelski 2y agoI often see this (gp's) sentient on HN and it is quite surprising to me given how people here specifically work in technology. Are we not intimately familiar with how one typically starts with small trial groups before we scale, so that we understand the effectiveness and safety? Or are we just "move fast and break things" and leave a mess in our wake with no one spending time to clean anything up. I guess that would explain enshitification. But seriously, S-curves aren't just about how the middle part looks exponential. Both ends are slow. Slow to start and slow to end. When technology B replaces technology A it is (almost) always WORSE than technology A initially. The difference is that its theoretical maximum is higher. Because guess what? In the long run if you stack a bunch of S-curves together, you get an exponential curve. And this is how so much technology has improved, including transistors, solar, batteries, and so on. Sometimes this slow start can be on the order of decades! The Motorola DynaTAC 8000X (1983) wasn't "a failure," it was a step to the IBM Simon (1992) which was a step to the iPhone (2007). So if you're exclusively chasing things that are better *now*, you won't make any progress. You have to invest. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technology_readiness_level https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technology_readiness_level
- jjk166 2y ago> After three years of meticulous and dedicated hard work, the Rhisotope Project at Wits University has successfully inserted low doses of radioisotopes into 20 live rhinoceros. Sounds like there is some inherent difficulty requiring years of meticulous and dedicated hard work to insert doses into 20 live rhinoceroses.
- wanderingstan 2y ago
- joot330 2y agoOne reason it’s an improvement is that radiation is detectable by already-existing methods used at the borders. So it will help catch them in the act of smuggling.
- jjk166 2y agoUnfortunately by the time this detects a piece of ivory, the damage is already done. If it took 3 years to inject 20 rhinos, it's unlikely that a large enough portion of the population could be injected to act as an effective deterrent for those actually killing the animals. Even for those actually involved in moving the ivory, it's only a deterrent if they actually face consequences at these borders - many states have weak enforcement of anti-ivory laws, and many more have bribable customs agents. Further, ivory has a value to weight ratio that is extremely conducive to smuggling.