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Japan's mini kei-truck sales surge in US despite safety concerns

pandaman 2y ago
Hundreds of the minitrucks are shipped by individual order each year to the US I imagine if they sold dozens before then it could be called a "surge", technically.
helsinkiandrew 2y ago
https://archive.ph/p8FSx https://archive.ph/p8FSx
zer00eyz 2y ago
People want pickups that are efficient and do work. The old 4 banger shit box 2 wheel drive Toyota that you rode till it turned to rust. Give me something that seats two, has ac and a radio (no giant screen) can fit a tool box and a sheet of plywood. You could make it electric. Hell if it can tow a small mini camper that would be great, but not needed.
- raddan 2y ago
  Amen.
- pushfoo 2y ago
  TL;DR: US manufacturers seem to favor the luxury market due to margins, but that might change To my understanding, there are two main demographics: * truck as tool (you and I) * truck as identity statement & luxury good Sadly, long-running vehicles don't fit the short-term stock price boost margins on luxury features seem to offer. As a result, we've moved past heated seats to focus on: * ever-growing size * tailgating accessories * touch screens and voice assistants However, even the target market for this seems to have its limits. I've seen a forum thread where people are asking what the point of Alexa is[1] if it doesn't integrate with anything. If you look at the "Similar threads" section at the bottom, there are plenty more Alexa sync issues. Maybe people will get fed up eventually? [1]: https://www.f150lightningforum.com/forum/threads/is-alexa-useless.15139/ https://www.f150lightningforum.com/forum/threads/is-alexa-us...
  - shrubble 2y ago
    There are tax advantages as I understand it if the truck is over a certain weight. This skews preferences towards a larger truck, since small trucks don't weigh enough.
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
  - infecto 2y ago
    "margins..." and market buying behavior. Trucks are indeed comically large, partly due to buyers, partly margins and partly US emission laws.
  - weberer 2y ago
    People are fed up, but the price floor for trucks are high due to US federal safety standards. These Kei trucks do not meet these standards, so manufacturers can sell them at a low price with decent margins.
- lmpdev 2y ago
  You just described the Toyota Hilux Champ $13,000 brand new If the Hilux is the terrorist’s choice this is the Myanmar Rebel’s (SE Asian market only) ——— Although my two cents as someone not blocked from Toyota’s best utility vehicles like those in the states are: The Toyota Landcruiser 70 series is the greatest pickup truck of all time bar none Essentially it’s the apocalypse version of the Hilux Only really ever popular in the middle east and Australia I see quite a few custom 6x6 double diesel tank variants in outback Australia Unfortunately Toyota realises how good it was/is and remarketed it at a price of ~$120,000 new
  - red-iron-pine 2y ago
    can't buy the Hilux in the US. you can buy the Tacoma, which is incredibly expensive by comparison. good truck, though -- Hilux robustness + N American Truck Luxury
Y_Y 2y ago
Yes, it might break someone's arm if you drive into them! Better get a Ford F450 and turn them into a fine red mist instead.
- infecto 2y ago
  While new trucks are comically oversized, the Kei sized trucks being imported are indeed death machines if you were to get into an accident. I don't think the US should care unless they want to get rid of that import loop hole law.
  - vfclists 2y ago
    > the Kei sized trucks being imported are indeed death machines if you were to get into an accident Would that because the other vehicles they would collide width are over-engineered, overweight and over-reinforced? As they less safe than bicycles and motorbikes in that respect?
    - infecto 2y ago
      Where were we talking about motorcycles or bicycles? "I don't think the US should care unless they want to get rid of that import loop hole law." I am simply stating fact. US federal law allows you to import vehicles that are 25+ years old without passing any safety or emission law. The Japanese market is already different enough in safety compared to the US market. These cars are indeed death traps if you were to get in an accident with an equivalently old US car.
      - vfclists 2y ago
        The point I'm trying to make is that far more vulnerable vehicles ply American roads, so the safety aspect is kind of questionable.
        infecto 2y ago
        So you are comparing a bicycle which are not allowed on most interstates/highways with a vehicle. Seems to be a pretty bad comparison.
jqpabc123 2y ago
The current truck market in the USA is a good example of how the "free market" works first and foremost to maximize profit --- not to the benefit and often to the detriment of consumers. The monstrosities currently being sold are completely divorced from the purpose a "truck" used to serve. These mini trucks are the response.
- skidd0 2y ago
  And this Kei Truck response is a good example of how a market (free or not), while seeking to find all profits, uncovers an unmet need in the market and adapts for the mutual benefit of the consumers And the producers.
  - lmpdev 2y ago
    I mean not really since they are imported used vehicles from Japan These trucks are illegal to sell new in the states Japanese producers aren’t designing these vehicles with American second hand JDM import buyers in mind Kei-truck manufacturers make no profit off this US uptick and consumers are at best irritated and at worst paying import fees because their domestic producers refuse to meet their needs and force them to cough up more cash for a vacuously useful and environmentally harmful oversized utility vehicles Markets can work, this is a clear example of it breaking down (for the US) and a sign the government should step in to steer the - arguably flailing - market
    - skidd0 2y ago
      You're suggesting government step in and stop the market from adapting around existing regulation? But that's how we got where we are right now. If government weren't in the way we'd have even more happy buyers. You point out US consumers might be annoyed at bad local options and are looking elsewhere then suggest that this is a failure of the market when in fact it is this market action that permits the consumer to find a better solution for their problems. All government can do if they "step in" is make this even harder. You cannot Force a market.
yardie 2y ago
For anyone interested in these trucks I came across this site, carfromjapan.com[0], that manage the logistics of acquire one. And some of the listed Kei trucks are crazy cheap compared to their full-size American competition. When I was a teen Japanese cars were all the rage and I managed to acquire a SR20DET for my Nissan 240SX. A completely impractical car for a broke college student. I would love to have one of these trucks to wrench on but I'm citified now and finding parking is already expensive. [0] https://carfromjapan.com/campaigns/referral-program?referralCode=CP-MUXD7DNT https://carfromjapan.com/campaigns/referral-program?referral...
odiroot 2y ago
"Safety concerns". Yes most probably due to all the Chelsea tractors around them.
asoneth 2y ago
I have a thirty-five-year-old truck and it's still perfectly fine for my hauling needs but out of curiosity I looked at what new trucks or minivans might be appropriate replacements when the time comes. A huge fraction of the trucks I looked at were comically gaudy and large, even the base models oozed luxury, and most were clearly designed around projecting a certain kind of image rather than prioritizing utility. I was reading about kei trucks when I came across Telo[1], a startup working on a US-legal electric kei truck. Depending on ground clearance that might tick every box for me even though I don't live in a city. They've got a steep hill ahead of them; I hope they succeed. [1] https://www.telotrucks.com/ https://www.telotrucks.com/
aidog 2y ago
Every grandpa in the japanese country side needs a kei truck. It's very practical. I moved apartments using one. The bed is hip height and opens quickly. The safety concern is someone else hitting you. I just got back from the McDonalds drivethrough and there was a lady alone in an american truck blocking everyone. I don't understand why anyone needs a car like that, they seem very dangerous.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
wiradikusuma 2y ago
Looking at the picture, that kind of vehicle is exactly what people in Indonesia have in mind when they talk about "truck". The first time I heard the likes of Ford F-150s, which are also called "trucks" in the US, I assumed that's because the driver's body is physically larger there. Of course I also wondered why those big trucks are fancier (more posh). I assumed the farmers there are richer.
iambateman 2y ago
This vehicle is the ideal of what an average truck should be… I wish a manufacturer would create an affordable truck in the same style, but with modern steel, airbags, and air conditioning. I don’t need it to be entertaining or signal masculinity or cost $65,000 or have a V8 engine or be capable of hauling 20,000 pounds. But when I need to get mulch or pick up furniture or help someone move, I’d like to have something functional that won’t kill me if someone driving a typical truck smashes into me while checking Twitter.

Hundreds of the minitrucks are shipped by individual order each year to the US I imagine if they sold dozens before then it could be called a "surge", technically.

helsinkiandrew 2y ago

https://archive.ph/p8FSx https://archive.ph/p8FSx

zer00eyz 2y ago

People want pickups that are efficient and do work. The old 4 banger shit box 2 wheel drive Toyota that you rode till it turned to rust. Give me something that seats two, has ac and a radio (no giant screen) can fit a tool box and a sheet of plywood. You could make it electric. Hell if it can tow a small mini camper that would be great, but not needed.

raddan 2y ago
Amen.
pushfoo 2y ago
TL;DR: US manufacturers seem to favor the luxury market due to margins, but that might change To my understanding, there are two main demographics: * truck as tool (you and I) * truck as identity statement & luxury good Sadly, long-running vehicles don't fit the short-term stock price boost margins on luxury features seem to offer. As a result, we've moved past heated seats to focus on: * ever-growing size * tailgating accessories * touch screens and voice assistants However, even the target market for this seems to have its limits. I've seen a forum thread where people are asking what the point of Alexa is[1] if it doesn't integrate with anything. If you look at the "Similar threads" section at the bottom, there are plenty more Alexa sync issues. Maybe people will get fed up eventually? [1]: https://www.f150lightningforum.com/forum/threads/is-alexa-useless.15139/ https://www.f150lightningforum.com/forum/threads/is-alexa-us...
- shrubble 2y ago
  There are tax advantages as I understand it if the truck is over a certain weight. This skews preferences towards a larger truck, since small trucks don't weigh enough.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
- infecto 2y ago
  "margins..." and market buying behavior. Trucks are indeed comically large, partly due to buyers, partly margins and partly US emission laws.
- weberer 2y ago
  People are fed up, but the price floor for trucks are high due to US federal safety standards. These Kei trucks do not meet these standards, so manufacturers can sell them at a low price with decent margins.
lmpdev 2y ago
You just described the Toyota Hilux Champ $13,000 brand new If the Hilux is the terrorist’s choice this is the Myanmar Rebel’s (SE Asian market only) ——— Although my two cents as someone not blocked from Toyota’s best utility vehicles like those in the states are: The Toyota Landcruiser 70 series is the greatest pickup truck of all time bar none Essentially it’s the apocalypse version of the Hilux Only really ever popular in the middle east and Australia I see quite a few custom 6x6 double diesel tank variants in outback Australia Unfortunately Toyota realises how good it was/is and remarketed it at a price of ~$120,000 new
- red-iron-pine 2y ago
  can't buy the Hilux in the US. you can buy the Tacoma, which is incredibly expensive by comparison. good truck, though -- Hilux robustness + N American Truck Luxury

Y_Y 2y ago

Yes, it might break someone's arm if you drive into them! Better get a Ford F450 and turn them into a fine red mist instead.

infecto 2y ago
While new trucks are comically oversized, the Kei sized trucks being imported are indeed death machines if you were to get into an accident. I don't think the US should care unless they want to get rid of that import loop hole law.
- vfclists 2y ago
  > the Kei sized trucks being imported are indeed death machines if you were to get into an accident Would that because the other vehicles they would collide width are over-engineered, overweight and over-reinforced? As they less safe than bicycles and motorbikes in that respect?
  - infecto 2y ago
    Where were we talking about motorcycles or bicycles? "I don't think the US should care unless they want to get rid of that import loop hole law." I am simply stating fact. US federal law allows you to import vehicles that are 25+ years old without passing any safety or emission law. The Japanese market is already different enough in safety compared to the US market. These cars are indeed death traps if you were to get in an accident with an equivalently old US car.
    - vfclists 2y ago
      The point I'm trying to make is that far more vulnerable vehicles ply American roads, so the safety aspect is kind of questionable.
      - infecto 2y ago
        So you are comparing a bicycle which are not allowed on most interstates/highways with a vehicle. Seems to be a pretty bad comparison.

jqpabc123 2y ago

The current truck market in the USA is a good example of how the "free market" works first and foremost to maximize profit --- not to the benefit and often to the detriment of consumers. The monstrosities currently being sold are completely divorced from the purpose a "truck" used to serve. These mini trucks are the response.

skidd0 2y ago
And this Kei Truck response is a good example of how a market (free or not), while seeking to find all profits, uncovers an unmet need in the market and adapts for the mutual benefit of the consumers And the producers.
- lmpdev 2y ago
  I mean not really since they are imported used vehicles from Japan These trucks are illegal to sell new in the states Japanese producers aren’t designing these vehicles with American second hand JDM import buyers in mind Kei-truck manufacturers make no profit off this US uptick and consumers are at best irritated and at worst paying import fees because their domestic producers refuse to meet their needs and force them to cough up more cash for a vacuously useful and environmentally harmful oversized utility vehicles Markets can work, this is a clear example of it breaking down (for the US) and a sign the government should step in to steer the - arguably flailing - market
  - skidd0 2y ago
    You're suggesting government step in and stop the market from adapting around existing regulation? But that's how we got where we are right now. If government weren't in the way we'd have even more happy buyers. You point out US consumers might be annoyed at bad local options and are looking elsewhere then suggest that this is a failure of the market when in fact it is this market action that permits the consumer to find a better solution for their problems. All government can do if they "step in" is make this even harder. You cannot Force a market.

yardie 2y ago

For anyone interested in these trucks I came across this site, carfromjapan.com[0], that manage the logistics of acquire one. And some of the listed Kei trucks are crazy cheap compared to their full-size American competition. When I was a teen Japanese cars were all the rage and I managed to acquire a SR20DET for my Nissan 240SX. A completely impractical car for a broke college student. I would love to have one of these trucks to wrench on but I'm citified now and finding parking is already expensive. [0] https://carfromjapan.com/campaigns/referral-program?referralCode=CP-MUXD7DNT https://carfromjapan.com/campaigns/referral-program?referral...

odiroot 2y ago

"Safety concerns". Yes most probably due to all the Chelsea tractors around them.

asoneth 2y ago

I have a thirty-five-year-old truck and it's still perfectly fine for my hauling needs but out of curiosity I looked at what new trucks or minivans might be appropriate replacements when the time comes. A huge fraction of the trucks I looked at were comically gaudy and large, even the base models oozed luxury, and most were clearly designed around projecting a certain kind of image rather than prioritizing utility. I was reading about kei trucks when I came across Telo[1], a startup working on a US-legal electric kei truck. Depending on ground clearance that might tick every box for me even though I don't live in a city. They've got a steep hill ahead of them; I hope they succeed. [1] https://www.telotrucks.com/ https://www.telotrucks.com/

aidog 2y ago

Every grandpa in the japanese country side needs a kei truck. It's very practical. I moved apartments using one. The bed is hip height and opens quickly. The safety concern is someone else hitting you. I just got back from the McDonalds drivethrough and there was a lady alone in an american truck blocking everyone. I don't understand why anyone needs a car like that, they seem very dangerous.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

wiradikusuma 2y ago

Looking at the picture, that kind of vehicle is exactly what people in Indonesia have in mind when they talk about "truck". The first time I heard the likes of Ford F-150s, which are also called "trucks" in the US, I assumed that's because the driver's body is physically larger there. Of course I also wondered why those big trucks are fancier (more posh). I assumed the farmers there are richer.

iambateman 2y ago

This vehicle is the ideal of what an average truck should be… I wish a manufacturer would create an affordable truck in the same style, but with modern steel, airbags, and air conditioning. I don’t need it to be entertaining or signal masculinity or cost $65,000 or have a V8 engine or be capable of hauling 20,000 pounds. But when I need to get mulch or pick up furniture or help someone move, I’d like to have something functional that won’t kill me if someone driving a typical truck smashes into me while checking Twitter.