5 ms·

Chase will soon share their customers' credit card with digital wallet Paze

52 points by guiambros 2y ago

et-al 2y ago
Thanks for sharing. Looks like I'll be calling customer service in the morning. Wonder if they'll even know what Paze is. > Chase will load your eligible Chase credit and debit cards to your Paze wallet on your behalf and then notify you when they are ready for use with participating online businesses. If you do not want your Chase cards automatically loaded into a Paze wallet, you may contact Chase to request that your eligible Chase credit and debit cards are not made available for use in a Paze wallet.
benguild 2y ago
great, how do we opt out
- inferiorhuman 2y ago
  https://www.chase.com/digital/digital-payments/paze https://www.chase.com/digital/digital-payments/paze Contact Chase through the Secure Message Center or by calling 1-800-935-9935 to request that your eligible Chase credit and debit cards are not made available for use. If your eligible credit or debit cards are already in Paze, you can remove your eligible Chase credit and debit cards at Chase Online℠ or in the Chase Mobile® app. You can also opt out of Paze through mywallet.paze.com, Opens overlay.
- steelframe 2y ago
  Pay for stuff with cash.
bleepbloop123 2y ago
Paze is not really a "startup": it's a product from the same company as Zelle. The company (Early Warning (earlywarning.com)) is "bank owned" and has been around for decades and is involved in fraud prevention for Chase (and others): Early Warning almost certainly already have much more than your credit card information.
iancarroll 2y ago
Paze is operated by a company called Early Warning Services, which is owned entirely by a collective of banks including Chase. They also run Zelle and a bunch of other infrastructure. Calling it a startup is a bit misleading.
- guiambros 2y ago
  You're right, I wasn't aware Early Warning also owned Zelle (although not sure if it makes it better or worse). I checked Crunchbase [1] before posting, and it sounded like an independent startup, with <50 employees. Whatever the case, as a Chase customer, it's upsetting that they're creating a digital wallet and loading my credit cards in a third party service without any consent nor easy way to opt-out. You need to message their customer service, and hope they are even aware of wth "Paze" is. @Dang, I fixed the title to be more accurate; I think this was the reason for the flag. Original title was "Chase will soon share their customers' credit card information with startup Paze" [1] https://www.crunchbase.com/organization/paze-848f https://www.crunchbase.com/organization/paze-848f
  - ozzcer 2y ago
    Everyone dogs on the EU but you know this would have to be opt-in there.
lowkey 2y ago
Fun fact: the only credit cards in America that do not share credit card data with 3rd parties are: 1/ Apple Card 2/ Local Credit Union Cards Apple doesn’t even have access to your transaction history as it is sired E2E encrypted in iCloud or on your local device. Goldman Sachs has access but they do not share it by the terms of their contract with Apple and privacy agreement.
- jser 2y ago
  Credit unions rely entirely on third parties for their infrastructure. FIS, Fiserv. Doubt Goldman Sachs can’t see it either - would make dispute handling and fraud prevention near impossible.
  - metadat 2y ago
    I happen to know dispute handling was challenging for GS to implement for the Apple Cards.
  - lowkey 2y ago
    Regardless of who handles the underlying payment rails (FIS, Fiserve, GS) it is the agreement that the payment processor has with the issuing bank that determines the ability to re-sell tx data to 3rd parties. Apple and Credit Unions have specifically put in place guardrails to protect their customer’s data. All other CC issuers optimize for the extra revenue at the expense of their user’s privacy.
excerionsforte 2y ago
Ugh, It's apparent that this is owned by the banks as there is no way in hell they would just opt in credit cards and debit cards to some random startup. I just don't like this idea that they can just push your information without you being able to opt out easily. Should've been opt in rather than opt out any way.
caleblloyd 2y ago
It’s by Early Warning Services, LLC (EWS) who makes Zelle too. Not a startup at this point > EWS was founded in 1990 and is co-owned by seven of the largest banks in the United States, including Bank of America, Capital One, JPMorgan Chase, PNC Bank, Truist, U.S. Bank, and Wells Fargo. They should change the name of EWS to something that consumers can grok, EWS sounds like it predicts severe weather, not makes apps that integrate with antiquated banking websites.
jser 2y ago
Early Warning Services already has your detailed bank history. This does have some benefits, like fraud prevention. Request a copy at https://www.earlywarning.com/consumer-information https://www.earlywarning.com/consumer-information
- instagib 2y ago
  15. Changes to this Privacy Notice From time to time, we may update this Privacy Notice. You agree that we may notify you about material changes in the way we treat Personal Information by placing a notice on the Website. You should check the Website frequently for updates.
nkellenicki 2y ago
So, this seems like an alternative to things like Apple Pay and Google Wallet. What's the benefit of the banks? Bigger cut of the transaction fees somehow? I must admit, I use Apple Pay whereever possible, I'll even temporarilly switch my browser to Safari if I see a merchant accepts Apple Pay, just because its so much easier than any other payment method.
- threatofrain 2y ago
  I do it because Apple is one of the most opaque payment vendors. I don't want a direct relationship with so many companies having my payment information.
- cen4 2y ago
  I still use cash. Its not hard or inconvenient.
  - dylan604 2y ago
    Oh, I've been looking for awhile, but every one is out of stock of that new device that allows you to insert your cash bills into a website. Where did you find one that had it in stock?
    - hdbv6 2y ago
      Ya monthly bills are done online. But most of my day to day expenses, eating out, shopping is mostly cash. It helps there are multiple ATMs around I guess.
Tempest1981 2y ago
Took me several reads to realize Paze is a homophone for "pays". I guess all the good names are taken.
blackeyeblitzar 2y ago
I'm beginning to think that paying by cash or having an anonymous digital payment method is critical. Also, how is it legal for places to say they only accept credit cards not cash. I am seeing this even for government run services, hospitals, etc.
- hunter2_ 2y ago
  > how is it legal for places to say they only accept credit cards not cash Because the requirement to take cash is only for payment of debt. Debt means you've received something before paying for it, so all they have to do is not put you in that situation. For example: If they serve your food before you pay, then you are in debt, and you can pay that debt in cash regardless of their preferences. But if they withhold serving your food until you pay, then at no point are you in debt, and they can refuse to deal with you.
instagib 2y ago
https://simpleoptout.com/#Chase https://simpleoptout.com/#Chase to start. If you do not want your Chase cards automatically loaded into a Paze wallet, you may contact Chase 1 to request that your eligible Chase credit and debit cards are not made available for use in a Paze wallet. Once they automatically add you can opt out through Paze 2. The chase link had no Paze information. I tried sending a message through my logged in account. There is no easy opt out option or button. These automatic opt-in things are bs but you can always use cash and linked gift cards I guess. 1. https://www.chase.com/digital/customer-service https://www.chase.com/digital/customer-service 2.https://www.paze.com/faq https://www.paze.com/faq
- instagib 2y ago
  Message while logged in works. Got a reply.
outcoldman 2y ago
I used to care about this. But I feel like at this point PI at least about US citizens has been stolen or sold so many times, so unless you made some serious changes, does it really matter at this point?
jhart99 2y ago
This seems like it would be square within CFPB complaint territory.
Greatvalue 2y ago
[flagged]

52 points by guiambros 2y ago

Thanks for sharing. Looks like I'll be calling customer service in the morning. Wonder if they'll even know what Paze is. > Chase will load your eligible Chase credit and debit cards to your Paze wallet on your behalf and then notify you when they are ready for use with participating online businesses. If you do not want your Chase cards automatically loaded into a Paze wallet, you may contact Chase to request that your eligible Chase credit and debit cards are not made available for use in a Paze wallet.

benguild 2y ago

great, how do we opt out

inferiorhuman 2y ago
https://www.chase.com/digital/digital-payments/paze https://www.chase.com/digital/digital-payments/paze Contact Chase through the Secure Message Center or by calling 1-800-935-9935 to request that your eligible Chase credit and debit cards are not made available for use. If your eligible credit or debit cards are already in Paze, you can remove your eligible Chase credit and debit cards at Chase Online℠ or in the Chase Mobile® app. You can also opt out of Paze through mywallet.paze.com, Opens overlay.
steelframe 2y ago
Pay for stuff with cash.

bleepbloop123 2y ago

Paze is not really a "startup": it's a product from the same company as Zelle. The company (Early Warning (earlywarning.com)) is "bank owned" and has been around for decades and is involved in fraud prevention for Chase (and others): Early Warning almost certainly already have much more than your credit card information.

iancarroll 2y ago

Paze is operated by a company called Early Warning Services, which is owned entirely by a collective of banks including Chase. They also run Zelle and a bunch of other infrastructure. Calling it a startup is a bit misleading.

guiambros 2y ago
You're right, I wasn't aware Early Warning also owned Zelle (although not sure if it makes it better or worse). I checked Crunchbase [1] before posting, and it sounded like an independent startup, with <50 employees. Whatever the case, as a Chase customer, it's upsetting that they're creating a digital wallet and loading my credit cards in a third party service without any consent nor easy way to opt-out. You need to message their customer service, and hope they are even aware of wth "Paze" is. @Dang, I fixed the title to be more accurate; I think this was the reason for the flag. Original title was "Chase will soon share their customers' credit card information with startup Paze" [1] https://www.crunchbase.com/organization/paze-848f https://www.crunchbase.com/organization/paze-848f
- ozzcer 2y ago
  Everyone dogs on the EU but you know this would have to be opt-in there.

lowkey 2y ago

Fun fact: the only credit cards in America that do not share credit card data with 3rd parties are: 1/ Apple Card 2/ Local Credit Union Cards Apple doesn’t even have access to your transaction history as it is sired E2E encrypted in iCloud or on your local device. Goldman Sachs has access but they do not share it by the terms of their contract with Apple and privacy agreement.

jser 2y ago
Credit unions rely entirely on third parties for their infrastructure. FIS, Fiserv. Doubt Goldman Sachs can’t see it either - would make dispute handling and fraud prevention near impossible.
- metadat 2y ago
  I happen to know dispute handling was challenging for GS to implement for the Apple Cards.
- lowkey 2y ago
  Regardless of who handles the underlying payment rails (FIS, Fiserve, GS) it is the agreement that the payment processor has with the issuing bank that determines the ability to re-sell tx data to 3rd parties. Apple and Credit Unions have specifically put in place guardrails to protect their customer’s data. All other CC issuers optimize for the extra revenue at the expense of their user’s privacy.

excerionsforte 2y ago

Ugh, It's apparent that this is owned by the banks as there is no way in hell they would just opt in credit cards and debit cards to some random startup. I just don't like this idea that they can just push your information without you being able to opt out easily. Should've been opt in rather than opt out any way.

caleblloyd 2y ago

It’s by Early Warning Services, LLC (EWS) who makes Zelle too. Not a startup at this point > EWS was founded in 1990 and is co-owned by seven of the largest banks in the United States, including Bank of America, Capital One, JPMorgan Chase, PNC Bank, Truist, U.S. Bank, and Wells Fargo. They should change the name of EWS to something that consumers can grok, EWS sounds like it predicts severe weather, not makes apps that integrate with antiquated banking websites.

jser 2y ago

Early Warning Services already has your detailed bank history. This does have some benefits, like fraud prevention. Request a copy at https://www.earlywarning.com/consumer-information https://www.earlywarning.com/consumer-information

instagib 2y ago
15. Changes to this Privacy Notice From time to time, we may update this Privacy Notice. You agree that we may notify you about material changes in the way we treat Personal Information by placing a notice on the Website. You should check the Website frequently for updates.

nkellenicki 2y ago

So, this seems like an alternative to things like Apple Pay and Google Wallet. What's the benefit of the banks? Bigger cut of the transaction fees somehow? I must admit, I use Apple Pay whereever possible, I'll even temporarilly switch my browser to Safari if I see a merchant accepts Apple Pay, just because its so much easier than any other payment method.

threatofrain 2y ago
I do it because Apple is one of the most opaque payment vendors. I don't want a direct relationship with so many companies having my payment information.
cen4 2y ago
I still use cash. Its not hard or inconvenient.
- dylan604 2y ago
  Oh, I've been looking for awhile, but every one is out of stock of that new device that allows you to insert your cash bills into a website. Where did you find one that had it in stock?
  - hdbv6 2y ago
    Ya monthly bills are done online. But most of my day to day expenses, eating out, shopping is mostly cash. It helps there are multiple ATMs around I guess.

Tempest1981 2y ago

Took me several reads to realize Paze is a homophone for "pays". I guess all the good names are taken.

blackeyeblitzar 2y ago

I'm beginning to think that paying by cash or having an anonymous digital payment method is critical. Also, how is it legal for places to say they only accept credit cards not cash. I am seeing this even for government run services, hospitals, etc.

hunter2_ 2y ago
> how is it legal for places to say they only accept credit cards not cash Because the requirement to take cash is only for payment of debt. Debt means you've received something before paying for it, so all they have to do is not put you in that situation. For example: If they serve your food before you pay, then you are in debt, and you can pay that debt in cash regardless of their preferences. But if they withhold serving your food until you pay, then at no point are you in debt, and they can refuse to deal with you.

instagib 2y ago

https://simpleoptout.com/#Chase https://simpleoptout.com/#Chase to start. If you do not want your Chase cards automatically loaded into a Paze wallet, you may contact Chase 1 to request that your eligible Chase credit and debit cards are not made available for use in a Paze wallet. Once they automatically add you can opt out through Paze 2. The chase link had no Paze information. I tried sending a message through my logged in account. There is no easy opt out option or button. These automatic opt-in things are bs but you can always use cash and linked gift cards I guess. 1. https://www.chase.com/digital/customer-service https://www.chase.com/digital/customer-service 2.https://www.paze.com/faq https://www.paze.com/faq

instagib 2y ago
Message while logged in works. Got a reply.

outcoldman 2y ago

I used to care about this. But I feel like at this point PI at least about US citizens has been stolen or sold so many times, so unless you made some serious changes, does it really matter at this point?

jhart99 2y ago

This seems like it would be square within CFPB complaint territory.

Greatvalue 2y ago

[flagged]