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I read until I stumbled upon that line: "I've been a programmer since I was six." You're NOT a programmer at six, you are a KID. You can play with computers,

I read until I stumbled upon that line: "I've been a programmer since I was six." You're NOT a programmer at six, you are a KID. You can play with computers, but being a programmer is a whole other story. You can tell yourself you're a programmer when you can code through a project by yourself, write classes, do OOP, implement basic concepts, differ public from static, know your data types, and more and more. You are not a programmer until you work as one. That's it and that's the reality. Nowadays kids called themselves programmer, guru, ninja, entrepreneur, etc and it makes me rage and laugh in anger. I'm sorry, your article seems fine, but you've lost all your credibility with this very single line.

mweil 14y ago
The author never used any of these adjectives to describe himself (except entrepreneur, which he is entitled to use since he started his own company). I agree with you that they are highly annoying terms to use and diminish our profession. That, however, does not excuse your hostile and unnecessary comment.
jasim 14y ago
> You can tell yourself you're a programmer when you can code through a project by yourself, write classes, do OOP, implement basic concepts, differ public from static, know your data types, and more and more. Knowing all that helps, but it doesn't mean you can't produce something meaningful without knowing all that. It would be hard, but doesn't make it impossible. > You are not a programmer until you work as one. That's it and that's the reality. No, you are a programmer when you understand the basics of programming. And that means the very basics. If I consider your argument, then everyone can call themselves a programmer only after being employed as one. What about kids who build software at school? I started writing code for accounting apps when I was around 11. I built what I considered my best work then when I was 14 (https://github.com/jasim/EasyAccounts/blob/master/DOCS/WHATSNEW.txt#L49 https://github.com/jasim/EasyAccounts/blob/master/DOCS/WHATS...). That was a working piece of software that was used by businesses. However - the fact that someone found use for the app is only incidental. The moment you know you can tell computers to do stuff you want to, however limited in scope, is when I would call someone a programmer. LOGO, GW-BASIC, dBase, VB 6, Rails or Haskell. It doesn't matter. [disclaimer: I work with Sidu and when he says he was a programmer at six, I know it is true]
- tbergeron 14y ago
  There's a nuance there and it's called an amateur. If I use this concept I could be anything and if everyone tells they're everything than what's the use of titles? You can be a passionate, an amateur but to be a programmer, a professional programmer there's only one way of becoming it and it's by doing a professional job.
makmanalp 14y ago
It's reasonable for him to assume that any reasonable person would not expect him to be a full-blown or even half-decent programmer at 6. When people say things like that, they mean that they dabbled, took existing programs and turned the circle into a square, copied code from their favourite computer magazine into a computer, moved a LOGO turtle around, etc. A lot of us came to be what we are by doing this. I don't understand the source of your anger and self-attributed superiority.
mindcrime 14y ago
Oh, please... quit worrying about some silly labels and adjectives. You are, as far as I'm concerned, a "programmer" if you write programs. How old you are, whether or not you get paid, what kind of credentials you have, etc. are totally irrelevant. Now if he qualified that as "I was a professional programmer at six" then I could see some (small) cause to say "Hey, wait a minute." But to get this up in arms over somebody saying they are / were a programmer? What's the point?
iamgopal 14y ago
when I was 8 or 10, I learned c with if and for loop and most basic of the language. I made a working chess text game using only ifs and loops, without even using any function etc. and well, I and family members actually played it a lot. and I think I have been programmer since.
- SonicSoul 14y ago
  cool. do you still have that source? something to show your grand kids for sure :)
- yolesaber 14y ago
  Heh reminds me of when I made my own Douglas Adams-esque text adventure in Python using only a huge chain of ifs and prints. I remember thinking the hardest part was doing all the typing!
bitwize 14y ago
No, you can only call yourself a professional programmer if you've worked as one. When you successfully program a computer, even if it's just: 10 PRINT "COCKS" 20 GOTO 10 -- you are a programmer.
- heliodor 14y ago
  Hmm, try replacing "programmer" with "garbage man" in your sentence.
  - bgilroy26 14y ago
    I don't understand your comment. If you ride around in the truck and throw the garbage in, you're a garbage man. We have tons of words for "programmer", enough to provide us with some nuance -- I think it's safe to say that the kid couldn't describe himself as a "software architect" -- we don't have as many for "garbage man".
telent 14y ago
I'm a cyclist but I've never worked as one

mweil 14y ago

The author never used any of these adjectives to describe himself (except entrepreneur, which he is entitled to use since he started his own company). I agree with you that they are highly annoying terms to use and diminish our profession. That, however, does not excuse your hostile and unnecessary comment.

jasim 14y ago

> You can tell yourself you're a programmer when you can code through a project by yourself, write classes, do OOP, implement basic concepts, differ public from static, know your data types, and more and more. Knowing all that helps, but it doesn't mean you can't produce something meaningful without knowing all that. It would be hard, but doesn't make it impossible. > You are not a programmer until you work as one. That's it and that's the reality. No, you are a programmer when you understand the basics of programming. And that means the very basics. If I consider your argument, then everyone can call themselves a programmer only after being employed as one. What about kids who build software at school? I started writing code for accounting apps when I was around 11. I built what I considered my best work then when I was 14 (https://github.com/jasim/EasyAccounts/blob/master/DOCS/WHATSNEW.txt#L49 https://github.com/jasim/EasyAccounts/blob/master/DOCS/WHATS...). That was a working piece of software that was used by businesses. However - the fact that someone found use for the app is only incidental. The moment you know you can tell computers to do stuff you want to, however limited in scope, is when I would call someone a programmer. LOGO, GW-BASIC, dBase, VB 6, Rails or Haskell. It doesn't matter. [disclaimer: I work with Sidu and when he says he was a programmer at six, I know it is true]

tbergeron 14y ago
There's a nuance there and it's called an amateur. If I use this concept I could be anything and if everyone tells they're everything than what's the use of titles? You can be a passionate, an amateur but to be a programmer, a professional programmer there's only one way of becoming it and it's by doing a professional job.

makmanalp 14y ago

It's reasonable for him to assume that any reasonable person would not expect him to be a full-blown or even half-decent programmer at 6. When people say things like that, they mean that they dabbled, took existing programs and turned the circle into a square, copied code from their favourite computer magazine into a computer, moved a LOGO turtle around, etc. A lot of us came to be what we are by doing this. I don't understand the source of your anger and self-attributed superiority.

mindcrime 14y ago

Oh, please... quit worrying about some silly labels and adjectives. You are, as far as I'm concerned, a "programmer" if you write programs. How old you are, whether or not you get paid, what kind of credentials you have, etc. are totally irrelevant. Now if he qualified that as "I was a professional programmer at six" then I could see some (small) cause to say "Hey, wait a minute." But to get this up in arms over somebody saying they are / were a programmer? What's the point?

iamgopal 14y ago

when I was 8 or 10, I learned c with if and for loop and most basic of the language. I made a working chess text game using only ifs and loops, without even using any function etc. and well, I and family members actually played it a lot. and I think I have been programmer since.

SonicSoul 14y ago
cool. do you still have that source? something to show your grand kids for sure :)
yolesaber 14y ago
Heh reminds me of when I made my own Douglas Adams-esque text adventure in Python using only a huge chain of ifs and prints. I remember thinking the hardest part was doing all the typing!

bitwize 14y ago

No, you can only call yourself a professional programmer if you've worked as one. When you successfully program a computer, even if it's just: 10 PRINT "COCKS" 20 GOTO 10 -- you are a programmer.

heliodor 14y ago
Hmm, try replacing "programmer" with "garbage man" in your sentence.
- bgilroy26 14y ago
  I don't understand your comment. If you ride around in the truck and throw the garbage in, you're a garbage man. We have tons of words for "programmer", enough to provide us with some nuance -- I think it's safe to say that the kid couldn't describe himself as a "software architect" -- we don't have as many for "garbage man".

telent 14y ago

I'm a cyclist but I've never worked as one