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> I was considering sales engineering because I get along with both engineers and salespeople and I hear they actually make more money than either, if they're a

> I was considering sales engineering because I get along with both engineers and salespeople and I hear they actually make more money than either, if they're any good Hi, former Sales Engineer/Manager here. SEs do not make more than their sales counterparts in salary/commission, and usually don’t make more in stock (although they often think they do.) In my best years, I would make half what my sales peer made. In bad years, I could make more as a percentage, but only because sales people are usually more leveraged (50/50 base/commission vs 70-80% base for an SE.)

nunez 2y ago
Definitely true, but given that sales folks were always always always on, I'd argue they make less per hour than SEs do.
- marcus0x62 2y ago
  Being an SE is the definition of an always-on job. The stress is (or, can be,) different than what an account manager faces, but the same underlying dynamic is the same: you're only ever as good as your last quarter and you can never achieve "enough". Beyond the mental aspects, SEs are frequently inserted, either officially or unofficially, in all manner of customer support processes like case escalation, managing beta software builds, arbitrating between the customer and professional services engineers, etc.
  - nunez 2y ago
    This is true (from what I've observed; you've been in the game longer than me!), but AEs are literally responsible for bringing in the business [0], whereas SEs are chiefly responsible for the technical win. I think the latter is way easier from how I've seen AEs operate. You're also right in that we get inserted into these wedge functions, but I haven't seen any of that bleed into my personal life like deals tend to do to AEs. [0] BDRs are LITERALLY responsible for pipe, so this isn't entirely true. However, many AEs are hired for their Rolodex, so to speak, and when they miss their forecasts, blaming BDR doesn't go very far.
  - pmarreck 2y ago
    > frequently inserted, either officially or unofficially, in all manner of customer support processes like case escalation, managing beta software builds, arbitrating between the customer and professional services engineers, etc. other than managing beta software builds, a lot of this stuff seems to be less impactful to the bottom line (of the business, and thus potentially to your salary) than just supporting the sales cycle from the technical side would be. I could see that happening though if there simply wasn't a constant stream of SE work to do. But I can't imagine that an hour burned on customer support, instead of an hour spent writing up how well the technical fit is to a particular customer in a big sales proposal, is making that company more money off you (and again, thus potentially impacting your salary ceiling).
    - marcus0x62 2y ago
      Managing beta builds is the least revenue impacting thing from that list. These tasks impact the company bottom line (and an SEs compensation) in that unhappy customers don't buy product. Leaving your customers to fend for themselves when they ask for help - and they will ask for help - will quickly lead to an SE getting replaced, either due to their company getting kicked out of an account and replaced with a competitor, or the SE kicked out of their company and replaced with a competitor. The general consensus is that SEs spend, on average, about 20% of their working time on "post-sales" tasks. I'm not aware of any published data in this area, but it tracks with my experience, both as an individual SE and an SE manager for 15 years.
      - pmarreck 2y ago
        That seems fair. Had no idea.
pmarreck 2y ago
My research seems to indicate the opposite Sales engineer average salary: https://builtin.com/salaries/dev-engineer/sales-engineer https://builtin.com/salaries/dev-engineer/sales-engineer Various pure sales salaries (I picked Tech Sales Representative but all of them seem lower except for senior titles like VP Sales): https://builtin.com/salaries/sales/tech-sales-representative https://builtin.com/salaries/sales/tech-sales-representative This is for software/technical sales, I believe, and not necessarily industrial technology sales Perhaps your pure sales peers were just very good, or they undercut you, or you were in an industry that didn't correlate with this... Or my data is wrong, or something else is amiss to explain this /shrug
- marcus0x62 2y ago
  Your data is wildly wrong for B2B tech sales.
  - pmarreck 2y ago
    I mean... From a single anecdotal data point, you can extrapolate in any direction...
    - marcusb 2y ago
      Sure, and without understanding the context of the data you are looking at, you can make all sorts of basic mistakes. Which you have done here. For instance, your "sales person" salary page you linked to is more likely to capture data for Sales Engineers than Account Managers. (Nobody calls their AMs "technical sales representatives.") I'm guessing you also don't understand the typical differences in base / commission ratios for account managers versus SEs - account managers are usually 50:50 while SEs are usually 70 - 80% base pay. That has a dramatic impact on total comp when someone is above 100% of their goal, especially with the impact of accelerators. Did you know sales engineers are frequently "pooled", supporting 2 - 4 account managers, with their commission typically being an average of the AMs they support? That's another thing that can drag SE comp down that basically never happens to AMs. And on and on and on. But, rather than admitting that you are out of your depth and showing some curiosity, you went with the "I spent five seconds googling this and you're wrong" shtick. Good job, or something. As for me, I'm not extrapolating from a single data point here. I worked in the industry for 15 years. I was a hiring manager for 5. I spent a lot of time talking to a lot of people about their salary expectations, both at the company I worked for and others.

nunez 2y ago

Definitely true, but given that sales folks were always always always on, I'd argue they make less per hour than SEs do.

marcus0x62 2y ago
Being an SE is the definition of an always-on job. The stress is (or, can be,) different than what an account manager faces, but the same underlying dynamic is the same: you're only ever as good as your last quarter and you can never achieve "enough". Beyond the mental aspects, SEs are frequently inserted, either officially or unofficially, in all manner of customer support processes like case escalation, managing beta software builds, arbitrating between the customer and professional services engineers, etc.
- nunez 2y ago
  This is true (from what I've observed; you've been in the game longer than me!), but AEs are literally responsible for bringing in the business [0], whereas SEs are chiefly responsible for the technical win. I think the latter is way easier from how I've seen AEs operate. You're also right in that we get inserted into these wedge functions, but I haven't seen any of that bleed into my personal life like deals tend to do to AEs. [0] BDRs are LITERALLY responsible for pipe, so this isn't entirely true. However, many AEs are hired for their Rolodex, so to speak, and when they miss their forecasts, blaming BDR doesn't go very far.
- pmarreck 2y ago
  > frequently inserted, either officially or unofficially, in all manner of customer support processes like case escalation, managing beta software builds, arbitrating between the customer and professional services engineers, etc. other than managing beta software builds, a lot of this stuff seems to be less impactful to the bottom line (of the business, and thus potentially to your salary) than just supporting the sales cycle from the technical side would be. I could see that happening though if there simply wasn't a constant stream of SE work to do. But I can't imagine that an hour burned on customer support, instead of an hour spent writing up how well the technical fit is to a particular customer in a big sales proposal, is making that company more money off you (and again, thus potentially impacting your salary ceiling).
  - marcus0x62 2y ago
    Managing beta builds is the least revenue impacting thing from that list. These tasks impact the company bottom line (and an SEs compensation) in that unhappy customers don't buy product. Leaving your customers to fend for themselves when they ask for help - and they will ask for help - will quickly lead to an SE getting replaced, either due to their company getting kicked out of an account and replaced with a competitor, or the SE kicked out of their company and replaced with a competitor. The general consensus is that SEs spend, on average, about 20% of their working time on "post-sales" tasks. I'm not aware of any published data in this area, but it tracks with my experience, both as an individual SE and an SE manager for 15 years.
    - pmarreck 2y ago
      That seems fair. Had no idea.

pmarreck 2y ago

My research seems to indicate the opposite Sales engineer average salary: https://builtin.com/salaries/dev-engineer/sales-engineer https://builtin.com/salaries/dev-engineer/sales-engineer Various pure sales salaries (I picked Tech Sales Representative but all of them seem lower except for senior titles like VP Sales): https://builtin.com/salaries/sales/tech-sales-representative https://builtin.com/salaries/sales/tech-sales-representative This is for software/technical sales, I believe, and not necessarily industrial technology sales Perhaps your pure sales peers were just very good, or they undercut you, or you were in an industry that didn't correlate with this... Or my data is wrong, or something else is amiss to explain this /shrug

marcus0x62 2y ago
Your data is wildly wrong for B2B tech sales.
- pmarreck 2y ago
  I mean... From a single anecdotal data point, you can extrapolate in any direction...
  - marcusb 2y ago
    Sure, and without understanding the context of the data you are looking at, you can make all sorts of basic mistakes. Which you have done here. For instance, your "sales person" salary page you linked to is more likely to capture data for Sales Engineers than Account Managers. (Nobody calls their AMs "technical sales representatives.") I'm guessing you also don't understand the typical differences in base / commission ratios for account managers versus SEs - account managers are usually 50:50 while SEs are usually 70 - 80% base pay. That has a dramatic impact on total comp when someone is above 100% of their goal, especially with the impact of accelerators. Did you know sales engineers are frequently "pooled", supporting 2 - 4 account managers, with their commission typically being an average of the AMs they support? That's another thing that can drag SE comp down that basically never happens to AMs. And on and on and on. But, rather than admitting that you are out of your depth and showing some curiosity, you went with the "I spent five seconds googling this and you're wrong" shtick. Good job, or something. As for me, I'm not extrapolating from a single data point here. I worked in the industry for 15 years. I was a hiring manager for 5. I spent a lot of time talking to a lot of people about their salary expectations, both at the company I worked for and others.