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Serious question, why not just switch to linux? I installed W11 after building gaming / workstation this year, and I've grudgingly left it in place because I d

Serious question, why not just switch to linux? I installed W11 after building gaming / workstation this year, and I've grudgingly left it in place because I don't want 'anti-cheat' hassles that you sometimes run into playing games with steam / proton. If WSL wasn't a thing I would have formatted it by now. Linux is just such a better experience for development. I also simply cannot shake the fear that windows is leaking every keystroke back to some MS service I haven't disabled.

nerdjon 2y ago
For me my windows setups are dedicated gaming devices, nothing more. Any general computing I do (with some random exceptions due to convenience) is on my Mac. So for me the number one priority is performance and compatibility. Which as far as proton has come, using the LTSC version on Windows easily wins on compatibility (especially once you leave Steam) and in some cases wins on performance. LTSC also drastically reduces the metrics sent back to Microsoft.
- metadat 2y ago
  macOS does offer a nicer overall UX than Windows, but the amount of telemetry Apple machines constantly stream to home base is disturbing. And unlike windows, I don't know of a way to turn it off. If you run Wireshark on any Mac you will observe the high volume of requests to Apple-owned IPs. Even when the machine is otherwise idle. It's creepy. On the other hand, Linux machines don't default to sending telemetry. P.s. Ubuntu is an exception to this rule which is one reason I'll never use Ubuntu again (they've included telemetry and embedded ads in the past). Debian and Pop_os both work remarkably well for desktop use these days.
  - DEADMINCE 2y ago
    > macOS does offer a nicer overall UX than Windows, Eh, does it? I find it to be incredibly unintuitive, and so do many people I see try to use it with no prior PC experience.
    - metadat 2y ago
      It's hard to compete with what Win2k offered. That seems like it was the ultimate in intuitive, user-friendly, and stable.
      - DEADMINCE 2y ago
        Funnily enough, I ran 2003 and then 2008 server versions as my desktop for a long time. No cruft and great performance. Very easy to enable desktop stuff and disable server stuff also.
npteljes 2y ago
For me, online multiplayer gaming. So now I have my Linux daily driver, and a gaming OS basically dual-booted.
- wing-_-nuts 2y ago
  Yeah, I ostensibly haven't switched back so I don't have to deal with anti-cheat issues, but if I'm really honest with myself I don't game nearly as much as I used to and when I do it's usually single player.
  - npteljes 2y ago
    Yes but I understand that you might not want to cut off the possibility. I personally dual-boot, but for similar convenience reasons I have some of the games installed on both systems. Even dual-booting is a bit of a pain, some of which I have solved by having a dedicated SSD for each OS. Windows sometimes misbehaves and it's easier to handle that if it has its own drive.
multimoon 2y ago
Gaming. Even while Proton is incredible - the experience with nvidia GPUs is still less than stellar. So if you want high resolution/framerate gaming - especially if you add HDR to that - you’re still stuck with windows. I’d love to switch to Linux if I could, I use it or MacOS for everything else.
- DEADMINCE 2y ago
  Exactly this. I was having a silly argument recently with someone that was trying to say Proton was just as good as DirectX/Windows, and it's really not even close in terms of support and stability, not to mention it only works with Steam initially.
  - nerdjon 2y ago
    I have noticed that there seems to be a subset of gamers that want so badly for Linux gaming to be a thing that they ignore the problems. For the record it is great, they have done a very good job with proton and I am not diminishing that work. But try to bring up this conversation on YouTube, reddit, or similar places and it becomes toxic very quickly. Even when presented with raw numbers. It has even gotten that way here a couple times. And the Steam thing is a big sore point right now, for the average user once you leave Steam it is not as user friendly as just running Windows. Valve's marketing also isn't helping the situation in the slightest.
    - DEADMINCE 2y ago
      It's just zealotry and tribalism. It's been a thing with Linux since I started using it back in 97 or whenever.
      - yesco 2y ago
        I'd say it's an inate property of all communities based around a given platform. It's not necessarily "wrong" either as obviously if someone is willing to use a platform, then they will also naturally be willing to overlook it's deficiencies. The discord arrives not because they do not acknowledge the deficiencies but due to a difference in priorities, what one person values another may not. It makes sense to me that their would be tension between people who want full control of their system & privacy in exchange for occasional performance cuts and unsupported anti cheats vs those that are comfortable completely giving up their privacy & control in exchange for occasional performance boosts and invasive anti cheats.
Paradigma11 2y ago
For me it is because I dont care about most negatives that are usually brought up. I need my os to get out of the way and be robust and W11 does that way better than Linux for me. I do have an Ubuntu Laptop and occasionally also try Linux in a VM or dual installation on my main desktop but it is always far more hassle than windows.
rldjbpin 2y ago
you just answered your own question, at least for gaming. the paid userbase for proton-based gaming needs to grow large enough to be taken seriously before most people can migrate.
t0bia_s 2y ago
Work. Adobe is standard (monopoly) in audiovisual production, graphic design snd DTP. Adobe is not working on linux. Yes, its frustrating. But there is no competition.

nerdjon 2y ago

For me my windows setups are dedicated gaming devices, nothing more. Any general computing I do (with some random exceptions due to convenience) is on my Mac. So for me the number one priority is performance and compatibility. Which as far as proton has come, using the LTSC version on Windows easily wins on compatibility (especially once you leave Steam) and in some cases wins on performance. LTSC also drastically reduces the metrics sent back to Microsoft.

metadat 2y ago
macOS does offer a nicer overall UX than Windows, but the amount of telemetry Apple machines constantly stream to home base is disturbing. And unlike windows, I don't know of a way to turn it off. If you run Wireshark on any Mac you will observe the high volume of requests to Apple-owned IPs. Even when the machine is otherwise idle. It's creepy. On the other hand, Linux machines don't default to sending telemetry. P.s. Ubuntu is an exception to this rule which is one reason I'll never use Ubuntu again (they've included telemetry and embedded ads in the past). Debian and Pop_os both work remarkably well for desktop use these days.
- DEADMINCE 2y ago
  > macOS does offer a nicer overall UX than Windows, Eh, does it? I find it to be incredibly unintuitive, and so do many people I see try to use it with no prior PC experience.
  - metadat 2y ago
    It's hard to compete with what Win2k offered. That seems like it was the ultimate in intuitive, user-friendly, and stable.
    - DEADMINCE 2y ago
      Funnily enough, I ran 2003 and then 2008 server versions as my desktop for a long time. No cruft and great performance. Very easy to enable desktop stuff and disable server stuff also.

npteljes 2y ago

For me, online multiplayer gaming. So now I have my Linux daily driver, and a gaming OS basically dual-booted.

wing-_-nuts 2y ago
Yeah, I ostensibly haven't switched back so I don't have to deal with anti-cheat issues, but if I'm really honest with myself I don't game nearly as much as I used to and when I do it's usually single player.
- npteljes 2y ago
  Yes but I understand that you might not want to cut off the possibility. I personally dual-boot, but for similar convenience reasons I have some of the games installed on both systems. Even dual-booting is a bit of a pain, some of which I have solved by having a dedicated SSD for each OS. Windows sometimes misbehaves and it's easier to handle that if it has its own drive.

multimoon 2y ago

Gaming. Even while Proton is incredible - the experience with nvidia GPUs is still less than stellar. So if you want high resolution/framerate gaming - especially if you add HDR to that - you’re still stuck with windows. I’d love to switch to Linux if I could, I use it or MacOS for everything else.

DEADMINCE 2y ago
Exactly this. I was having a silly argument recently with someone that was trying to say Proton was just as good as DirectX/Windows, and it's really not even close in terms of support and stability, not to mention it only works with Steam initially.
- nerdjon 2y ago
  I have noticed that there seems to be a subset of gamers that want so badly for Linux gaming to be a thing that they ignore the problems. For the record it is great, they have done a very good job with proton and I am not diminishing that work. But try to bring up this conversation on YouTube, reddit, or similar places and it becomes toxic very quickly. Even when presented with raw numbers. It has even gotten that way here a couple times. And the Steam thing is a big sore point right now, for the average user once you leave Steam it is not as user friendly as just running Windows. Valve's marketing also isn't helping the situation in the slightest.
  - DEADMINCE 2y ago
    It's just zealotry and tribalism. It's been a thing with Linux since I started using it back in 97 or whenever.
    - yesco 2y ago
      I'd say it's an inate property of all communities based around a given platform. It's not necessarily "wrong" either as obviously if someone is willing to use a platform, then they will also naturally be willing to overlook it's deficiencies. The discord arrives not because they do not acknowledge the deficiencies but due to a difference in priorities, what one person values another may not. It makes sense to me that their would be tension between people who want full control of their system & privacy in exchange for occasional performance cuts and unsupported anti cheats vs those that are comfortable completely giving up their privacy & control in exchange for occasional performance boosts and invasive anti cheats.

Paradigma11 2y ago

For me it is because I dont care about most negatives that are usually brought up. I need my os to get out of the way and be robust and W11 does that way better than Linux for me. I do have an Ubuntu Laptop and occasionally also try Linux in a VM or dual installation on my main desktop but it is always far more hassle than windows.

rldjbpin 2y ago

you just answered your own question, at least for gaming. the paid userbase for proton-based gaming needs to grow large enough to be taken seriously before most people can migrate.

t0bia_s 2y ago

Work. Adobe is standard (monopoly) in audiovisual production, graphic design snd DTP. Adobe is not working on linux. Yes, its frustrating. But there is no competition.