4 ms·

Why not just use Win10 LTSC ?

kelsey98765431 2y ago
The amount of people doing this was so vast that windows 10 ltsc stopped receiving updates when windows 11 was first announced and by happy coincidence is just ever so slightly too old now for the benefits versus just using linux with proton on steam.
- nerdjon 2y ago
  I do not believe this is true. Windows 10 LTSC will continue to get security improvements at least until next year depending on the LTSC version you have installed and up to 2032. As far as it not getting a new cut version after the 2021 one, I feel like that is just normal practice? Does Microsoft normally cut a new version of their LTSC version on an older OS when they are working on the next version? Was there even a need for a new 10 LTSC after 2021?
  - DEADMINCE 2y ago
    LTSC is a fantastic solution if Windows is a need, but there is no getting around it that the only way you can use it, or most people, is via piracy. You're ethically fine with it, but it's still a problem for many, even if purely due to legal concerns and not ethical ones. I want to game as well, but thankfully most of what I want to run will run on Linux. GTA6 likely won't, and then I'll have to look at streaming with moonlight or something, or playing on a VM with GPU passthrough. Qemu is making advances at allowing VMs to hide that they are VMs, so that might end up being a great solution.
    - nerdjon 2y ago
      It is worth putting out a very big caveat here that "piracy" in this sense is not downloading an Iso through BitTorrent when Microsoft provides the ISO for LTSC to freely download through your browser. The 'piracy' element is running an activation script off of GitHub. However IMO that is Microsoft problem and not mine for not providing a legal way for a normal consumer to get LTSC. They could make it another tier and charge more if they were inclined. I hate the idea of paying for privacy, but ethically I would be compelled to do so if the option was available to me. As said in other comments, personally ethically the way I justify it is I already have a Windows 11 License and I am just installing a different version of 11. Microsoft still got the money. Given that there is no torrenting and it is just a script you are running, I am legitimately curious about any legal ramifications. > but thankfully most of what I want to run will run on Linux. For me once I hit "most" and not "all" I asked myself why I was bothering, I was dual booting SteamOS and Windows but using Windows the vast majority of the time. Been debating recently on re-imaging and continuing to dual boot but solely to have SteamOS for firmware updates.
      - DEADMINCE 2y ago
        > The 'piracy' element is running an activation script off of GitHub. You're modifying software against the terms of service to have functionality only offered by an entirely different license that costs substantially more. Yeah, you're not downloading ISOs or using cracks but it is absolutely no less piracy. > However IMO that is Microsoft problem and not mine for not providing a legal way for a normal consumer to get LTSC. Sure, but that's their business decision and right. If you want it you can pay for it, just like if you want an expensive sportscar you have to pony up for that as well. > Given that there is no torrenting and it is just a script you are running, I am legitimately curious about any legal ramifications. For you individually, I'm sure you know they won't care, just as they already don't care about all the gamers with all the watermarked pirated versions of Windows. You're more than likely absolutely safe. But it's still just as much piracy as downloading an ISO and using a crack, and you would be just as legally culpable. > For me once I hit "most" and not "all" I asked myself why I was bothering, Honestly it's because Windows is still your enemy. You can tame it, but you have to fight with it. Sure, you can get it pretty good, and you eliminate a lot of problems using the ltsc version, but you still don't own the software and they could still fuck with it and by extension you and one day there might not be a script to fix it. Personally, I think it makes significantly more sense to keep windows around only to run the few games that won't work on Linux, not as a main OS. At this point, even the LTSC versions, are basically untrusted, hostile software. Everyone's has different views on this though, balancing conveience and other needs, so it's not like there's an objective answer.
nerdjon 2y ago
I think 10LTSC is perfectly viable right now, I still run 10LTSC on my Steam Deck. Right now on my desktop I have 10 LTSC, 11 LTSC, and 11 Pro installed and doing a bunch of benchmarks but still early on data (trying to be as thorough as possible). I have had someone try to tell me that there is something in Windows 11 that makes it run better on newer processors, I have not been able to find any information on this. Also theoretically at some point driver support or game support will diminish on 10. Personally, I think if you are going to go for a new installation 11 likely may be the way to go for the best future compatibility. But 10 is still good.
- arprocter 2y ago
  >I have had someone try to tell me that there is something in Windows 11 that makes it run better on newer processors, I have not been able to find any information on this. Possibly they were referring to this: https://www.anandtech.com/show/16959/intel-innovation-alder-lake-november-4th/3 https://www.anandtech.com/show/16959/intel-innovation-alder-...
  - nerdjon 2y ago
    That is it! I remember something about the scheduler. Will need to do some more research and benchmarks on this personally and see if it is really much of an improvement or if the improvements are lost by any decrease in performance going from 10 to 11 (even on LTSC).
    - arprocter 2y ago
      I'm not sure it would make a difference on a Steam Deck, as E and P cores are an Intel thing
      - nerdjon 2y ago
        Most likely not, however I run LTSC on 4 different gaming setups. Steam Deck, Legion GO, and 2 desktops of various power for TV and desktop gaming. So I have a decent range of hardware to test these claims on.

The amount of people doing this was so vast that windows 10 ltsc stopped receiving updates when windows 11 was first announced and by happy coincidence is just ever so slightly too old now for the benefits versus just using linux with proton on steam.

nerdjon 2y ago
I do not believe this is true. Windows 10 LTSC will continue to get security improvements at least until next year depending on the LTSC version you have installed and up to 2032. As far as it not getting a new cut version after the 2021 one, I feel like that is just normal practice? Does Microsoft normally cut a new version of their LTSC version on an older OS when they are working on the next version? Was there even a need for a new 10 LTSC after 2021?
- DEADMINCE 2y ago
  LTSC is a fantastic solution if Windows is a need, but there is no getting around it that the only way you can use it, or most people, is via piracy. You're ethically fine with it, but it's still a problem for many, even if purely due to legal concerns and not ethical ones. I want to game as well, but thankfully most of what I want to run will run on Linux. GTA6 likely won't, and then I'll have to look at streaming with moonlight or something, or playing on a VM with GPU passthrough. Qemu is making advances at allowing VMs to hide that they are VMs, so that might end up being a great solution.
  - nerdjon 2y ago
    It is worth putting out a very big caveat here that "piracy" in this sense is not downloading an Iso through BitTorrent when Microsoft provides the ISO for LTSC to freely download through your browser. The 'piracy' element is running an activation script off of GitHub. However IMO that is Microsoft problem and not mine for not providing a legal way for a normal consumer to get LTSC. They could make it another tier and charge more if they were inclined. I hate the idea of paying for privacy, but ethically I would be compelled to do so if the option was available to me. As said in other comments, personally ethically the way I justify it is I already have a Windows 11 License and I am just installing a different version of 11. Microsoft still got the money. Given that there is no torrenting and it is just a script you are running, I am legitimately curious about any legal ramifications. > but thankfully most of what I want to run will run on Linux. For me once I hit "most" and not "all" I asked myself why I was bothering, I was dual booting SteamOS and Windows but using Windows the vast majority of the time. Been debating recently on re-imaging and continuing to dual boot but solely to have SteamOS for firmware updates.
    - DEADMINCE 2y ago
      > The 'piracy' element is running an activation script off of GitHub. You're modifying software against the terms of service to have functionality only offered by an entirely different license that costs substantially more. Yeah, you're not downloading ISOs or using cracks but it is absolutely no less piracy. > However IMO that is Microsoft problem and not mine for not providing a legal way for a normal consumer to get LTSC. Sure, but that's their business decision and right. If you want it you can pay for it, just like if you want an expensive sportscar you have to pony up for that as well. > Given that there is no torrenting and it is just a script you are running, I am legitimately curious about any legal ramifications. For you individually, I'm sure you know they won't care, just as they already don't care about all the gamers with all the watermarked pirated versions of Windows. You're more than likely absolutely safe. But it's still just as much piracy as downloading an ISO and using a crack, and you would be just as legally culpable. > For me once I hit "most" and not "all" I asked myself why I was bothering, Honestly it's because Windows is still your enemy. You can tame it, but you have to fight with it. Sure, you can get it pretty good, and you eliminate a lot of problems using the ltsc version, but you still don't own the software and they could still fuck with it and by extension you and one day there might not be a script to fix it. Personally, I think it makes significantly more sense to keep windows around only to run the few games that won't work on Linux, not as a main OS. At this point, even the LTSC versions, are basically untrusted, hostile software. Everyone's has different views on this though, balancing conveience and other needs, so it's not like there's an objective answer.

nerdjon 2y ago

I think 10LTSC is perfectly viable right now, I still run 10LTSC on my Steam Deck. Right now on my desktop I have 10 LTSC, 11 LTSC, and 11 Pro installed and doing a bunch of benchmarks but still early on data (trying to be as thorough as possible). I have had someone try to tell me that there is something in Windows 11 that makes it run better on newer processors, I have not been able to find any information on this. Also theoretically at some point driver support or game support will diminish on 10. Personally, I think if you are going to go for a new installation 11 likely may be the way to go for the best future compatibility. But 10 is still good.

arprocter 2y ago
>I have had someone try to tell me that there is something in Windows 11 that makes it run better on newer processors, I have not been able to find any information on this. Possibly they were referring to this: https://www.anandtech.com/show/16959/intel-innovation-alder-lake-november-4th/3 https://www.anandtech.com/show/16959/intel-innovation-alder-...
- nerdjon 2y ago
  That is it! I remember something about the scheduler. Will need to do some more research and benchmarks on this personally and see if it is really much of an improvement or if the improvements are lost by any decrease in performance going from 10 to 11 (even on LTSC).
  - arprocter 2y ago
    I'm not sure it would make a difference on a Steam Deck, as E and P cores are an Intel thing
    - nerdjon 2y ago
      Most likely not, however I run LTSC on 4 different gaming setups. Steam Deck, Legion GO, and 2 desktops of various power for TV and desktop gaming. So I have a decent range of hardware to test these claims on.