4 ms·

What’s the procedure for even putting out a fire like that? Just wait it out?

jnsaff2 2y ago
Manage the spread of fire and heat damage to surroundings until the fire burns out. Once the lithium fire gets going it is almost impossible to extinguish it.
jillesvangurp 2y ago
Cooling them with lots of water generally. The challenge is that lithium ion battery fires supply their own oxygen (chemically released, which then combusts with the other gases). So starving them of oxygen doesn't work, generally.
- ChrisMarshallNY 2y ago
  Used to have a chemistry teacher that would entertain the class, by dropping a chunk of lithium into a big bowl of water. Fun stuff. They don't make 'em like that, anymore. On-topic: This took out half the workforce. Maybe almost everyone that gets their hands dirty. Not sure that company will survive this.
  - alias_neo 2y ago
    Devastating. Having read the article, it sounds like it wasn't a fire as much as a lithium-cell explosion, which would explain the damage and why people couldn't get to safety. off-topic: My chemistry teacher also plopped chunks of lithium into bowls of water for our edutainment.
- jeffbee 2y ago
  Not all lithium cell primary batteries contain oxygen.
  - jillesvangurp 2y ago
    depends on the electrolyte of course, which is generally one of the more flammable bits.
- tremon 2y ago
  Doesn't water have the exact same problem in the context of electric charge? The water might get hydrolyzed, producing even more oxygen and giving you hydrogen gas as a bonus. "Lots of water" might be an understatement -- if you can't submerge the entire battery in water, don't even try it.
jeffbee 2y ago
A "Class D" fire extinguisher, which contain powdered metals, or cover it in dry, fine sand, which you will need to have pre-placed for this purpose because you can't extinguish such a fire with damp sand.
- perihelions 2y ago
  Remarkable and interesting that powdered metals can be fire-extinguishing agents. I'd have guessed they'd be flammable themselves. https://amerexfireextinguishers.com/products/amerex-30lb-class-d-c571 https://amerexfireextinguishers.com/products/amerex-30lb-cla... ("30 lb Class D Copper Fire Extinguisher - Model C571") - "MODEL C571 contains a copper extinguishing agent specially developed by the U.S. Navy for fighting lithium and lithium alloy fires. The copper compound smothers the fire and provides an excellent heat sink for dissipating heat. Copper powder has been found to be superior to all other known fire extinguishing agents for lithium metal fires. Not recommended for lithium-ion battery fires."
  - fuzzfactor 2y ago
    Maybe it mitigates by alloying a bit.

Manage the spread of fire and heat damage to surroundings until the fire burns out. Once the lithium fire gets going it is almost impossible to extinguish it.

jillesvangurp 2y ago

Cooling them with lots of water generally. The challenge is that lithium ion battery fires supply their own oxygen (chemically released, which then combusts with the other gases). So starving them of oxygen doesn't work, generally.

ChrisMarshallNY 2y ago
Used to have a chemistry teacher that would entertain the class, by dropping a chunk of lithium into a big bowl of water. Fun stuff. They don't make 'em like that, anymore. On-topic: This took out half the workforce. Maybe almost everyone that gets their hands dirty. Not sure that company will survive this.
- alias_neo 2y ago
  Devastating. Having read the article, it sounds like it wasn't a fire as much as a lithium-cell explosion, which would explain the damage and why people couldn't get to safety. off-topic: My chemistry teacher also plopped chunks of lithium into bowls of water for our edutainment.
jeffbee 2y ago
Not all lithium cell primary batteries contain oxygen.
- jillesvangurp 2y ago
  depends on the electrolyte of course, which is generally one of the more flammable bits.
tremon 2y ago
Doesn't water have the exact same problem in the context of electric charge? The water might get hydrolyzed, producing even more oxygen and giving you hydrogen gas as a bonus. "Lots of water" might be an understatement -- if you can't submerge the entire battery in water, don't even try it.

jeffbee 2y ago

A "Class D" fire extinguisher, which contain powdered metals, or cover it in dry, fine sand, which you will need to have pre-placed for this purpose because you can't extinguish such a fire with damp sand.

perihelions 2y ago
Remarkable and interesting that powdered metals can be fire-extinguishing agents. I'd have guessed they'd be flammable themselves. https://amerexfireextinguishers.com/products/amerex-30lb-class-d-c571 https://amerexfireextinguishers.com/products/amerex-30lb-cla... ("30 lb Class D Copper Fire Extinguisher - Model C571") - "MODEL C571 contains a copper extinguishing agent specially developed by the U.S. Navy for fighting lithium and lithium alloy fires. The copper compound smothers the fire and provides an excellent heat sink for dissipating heat. Copper powder has been found to be superior to all other known fire extinguishing agents for lithium metal fires. Not recommended for lithium-ion battery fires."
- fuzzfactor 2y ago
  Maybe it mitigates by alloying a bit.