3 ms·

It's always amuses me how people blame Elop, completely ignoring everything what was done before him. >> No. You should re-read that memo, specifically startin

It's always amuses me how people blame Elop, completely ignoring everything what was done before him. >> No. You should re-read that memo, specifically starting at "In 2008, Apple's market share in the $300+ price range was 25 percent; by 2010 it escalated to 61 percent." paragraph. >> In 2010 nobody was interested in Symbian, no one else made phones on Symbian, no one would do apps for Symbian[0] - who would bother with all the Symbian shenanigans when even Nokia itself said what it would move to MeeGo 'soon', along with ~10% of smartphone market? Money was in Apple and Android. >> Should I remind you what Elop's memo was a month later, in February 2011? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35038979 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35038979

pjmlp 2y ago
There is a difference from random people around the Internet, and people that were actually Nokia employees at the time. And yes, the board as well had its own share to blame, including hiring Elop in first place, with a big bonus payment clause if he managed to sell Nokia Mobile business unit, which naturally he ended up doing as well, and created a huge scandal in Finland's press at the time.
- justsomehnguy 2y ago
  > people that were actually Nokia employees at the time. >> I was on the Networks unit By the time the board hired Elop Nokia-tanic was already with a giant hull breach. Sure, you can claim what your personal experience of an unrelated unit in Nokia gives you a proper visibility to the circumstances, but what Nokia actually did before the memo is telling what were happening there way better than your experience. And... HP-UX? In 2010? Sigh.
  - pjmlp 2y ago
    See, by 2010, we were already focusing on Red-Hat Linux.... You have no idea of what visibility I actually had, how Networks worked with Mobile, which buildings we shared, common lunch talks, nor I am going to disclose most of the NDA stuff. So think whatever you want out of it.
    - justsomehnguy 2y ago
      > ou have no idea of what visibility I actually had Yes. But I have a very good idea of what products Nokia shipped before the memo and they were quite shit, compared to the other options on the market. Just re-read the memo itself and explain with a honest heart how exactly Apple got to 61% in 2010? Was that the evil Elop doing things? Or that was Nokia and Nokia employees doing shit for years before 2010? You are perfectly aware what to lose the market in 2010 you need to make shit products in 2007-2009, because you can't be totally fine all this time and at Dec 31 2010 BAM all the base belong to Apple. > which buildings we shared, common lunch talks Puhlease, lunch talks don't push a shitty products to the market. It's the internal bureaucracy, lack of the ability to take the responsibility and overall the bloated and entrenched corporate culture of Nokia what does that.

pjmlp 2y ago

There is a difference from random people around the Internet, and people that were actually Nokia employees at the time. And yes, the board as well had its own share to blame, including hiring Elop in first place, with a big bonus payment clause if he managed to sell Nokia Mobile business unit, which naturally he ended up doing as well, and created a huge scandal in Finland's press at the time.

justsomehnguy 2y ago
> people that were actually Nokia employees at the time. >> I was on the Networks unit By the time the board hired Elop Nokia-tanic was already with a giant hull breach. Sure, you can claim what your personal experience of an unrelated unit in Nokia gives you a proper visibility to the circumstances, but what Nokia actually did before the memo is telling what were happening there way better than your experience. And... HP-UX? In 2010? Sigh.
- pjmlp 2y ago
  See, by 2010, we were already focusing on Red-Hat Linux.... You have no idea of what visibility I actually had, how Networks worked with Mobile, which buildings we shared, common lunch talks, nor I am going to disclose most of the NDA stuff. So think whatever you want out of it.
  - justsomehnguy 2y ago
    > ou have no idea of what visibility I actually had Yes. But I have a very good idea of what products Nokia shipped before the memo and they were quite shit, compared to the other options on the market. Just re-read the memo itself and explain with a honest heart how exactly Apple got to 61% in 2010? Was that the evil Elop doing things? Or that was Nokia and Nokia employees doing shit for years before 2010? You are perfectly aware what to lose the market in 2010 you need to make shit products in 2007-2009, because you can't be totally fine all this time and at Dec 31 2010 BAM all the base belong to Apple. > which buildings we shared, common lunch talks Puhlease, lunch talks don't push a shitty products to the market. It's the internal bureaucracy, lack of the ability to take the responsibility and overall the bloated and entrenched corporate culture of Nokia what does that.