3 ms·

It is possible, just increase prices by 20% and pay servers. Not that hard.

viraptor 2y ago
Convince the whole country to stop taking tips and pay 20% extra then. Let us know how easy that was... My whole point is that it's not reasonable not to take tips in the us today.
- kelipso 2y ago
  The 20% part is easy enough, a year of inflation prove that pretty well. Now you just need to make tipping illegal, pretty straightforward really.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - randomdata 2y ago
    Not exactly straightforward when alcohol is sold. Alcohol laws see liability placed on the server, which means that technically transaction is directly between the customer and the server. Which is no doubt why tipping traditionally was only a practice in places where alcohol is sold. I can't imagine we want to change that. Allowing someone to give endless amounts of alcohol to a customer without any repercussions is rife with problems, and removing the ability for a customer to pay a vendor for services rendered would undo everything we know.
    - gruez 2y ago
      >Not exactly straightforward when alcohol is sold. Alcohol laws see liability placed on the server, which means that technically transaction is directly between the customer and the server. Which is no doubt why tipping traditionally was only a practice in places where alcohol is sold. This is an absolutely bizarre take. The fact that bartenders have liability to not serve patrons absurd amounts of alcohol, has no bearing on what the transaction is "technically" between. If you really want to get down to brass tacks, I doubt the merchant account on the credit card machine is going to the bartender, nor is the revenue showing up on his tax returns. Moreover, bartending isn't the only profession where you take on liability. Doctors are liable for malpractice as well. Does that mean you should tip your doctors as well?
      - randomdata 2y ago
        By and large doctors operate independent businesses, so you are tipping them. Of course, doctors working as employees isn't completely unheard of. If you are worried about consistency, then you absolutely should also be tipping those in that situation, but as tipping on employment arrangements is never expected anywhere, not even where alcohol is sold, there is no onus for you to. It is your life to live. Do what you want.
        gruez 2y ago
        >By and large doctors operate independent businesses, so you are tipping them. Again, this is a bizarre take. The fact the person is the proprietor of the business doesn't mean you're "tipping" them by mere virtue of patronizing their business. Taxi drivers also operate as independent businesses, but it's a stretch to call the mere fact of paying your bill (ie. without adding anything extra) "tipping".
        randomdata 2y ago
        Any agreement between a patron and a server to exchange an offer of value is also just "paying the bill". Any agreement between the patron and venue is a separate transaction. The law in most jurisdictions makes this quite clear.
        gruez 2y ago
        What does that have to do with your claim that you're "tipping" doctors when you pay exactly what you owe? Or are you living in some bizzaro world where people actually pay doctors extra on top?
        deleted 2y ago
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        2y ago
    - KptMarchewa 2y ago
      Another unsolvable problem for US that has been solved... eh, anywhere else?
      - randomdata 2y ago
        There are no countries where tipping is illegal. It is not a solved “problem”. Of course, tipping isn't required anywhere, and that includes the US. If you don't want to tip... don't?
      - kelipso 2y ago
        Haha I find the ridiculous arguments that Americans make to justify whatever insane customs they have somewhat entertaining.
- wkrsz 2y ago
  I imagine restaurant chains could make this their competitive advantage: "No hidden costs. Service included. No tips expected. What you seen on the menu is the real price" I'd be inclined to choose such a place as a tourist from Europe, who's accustomed to tipping being optional.
  - kleinsch 2y ago
    That's not how most people think. JCPenny tried removing discounts and clearance sales so they could say "what you see is the real price" and it was a disaster. Most people aren't doing the mental math to decide what's actually more expensive. https://www.cnn.com/2018/09/27/business/jcpenney-history/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2018/09/27/business/jcpenney-history/ind...
tzs 2y ago
For people that are currently paying 20% tips that's a big win. It doesn't change what they pay but streamlines the process. But for people who are currently not tipping or paying less than 20% it would be a price increase. If the people not tipping or tipping less than 20% were evenly distributed across all age, income, and other demographic groups probably nobody else would care. Unfortunately non-tipping and low tipping is not evenly distributed in the US. That would need to be taken into account.

Convince the whole country to stop taking tips and pay 20% extra then. Let us know how easy that was... My whole point is that it's not reasonable not to take tips in the us today.

kelipso 2y ago
The 20% part is easy enough, a year of inflation prove that pretty well. Now you just need to make tipping illegal, pretty straightforward really.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- randomdata 2y ago
  Not exactly straightforward when alcohol is sold. Alcohol laws see liability placed on the server, which means that technically transaction is directly between the customer and the server. Which is no doubt why tipping traditionally was only a practice in places where alcohol is sold. I can't imagine we want to change that. Allowing someone to give endless amounts of alcohol to a customer without any repercussions is rife with problems, and removing the ability for a customer to pay a vendor for services rendered would undo everything we know.
  - gruez 2y ago
    >Not exactly straightforward when alcohol is sold. Alcohol laws see liability placed on the server, which means that technically transaction is directly between the customer and the server. Which is no doubt why tipping traditionally was only a practice in places where alcohol is sold. This is an absolutely bizarre take. The fact that bartenders have liability to not serve patrons absurd amounts of alcohol, has no bearing on what the transaction is "technically" between. If you really want to get down to brass tacks, I doubt the merchant account on the credit card machine is going to the bartender, nor is the revenue showing up on his tax returns. Moreover, bartending isn't the only profession where you take on liability. Doctors are liable for malpractice as well. Does that mean you should tip your doctors as well?
    - randomdata 2y ago
      By and large doctors operate independent businesses, so you are tipping them. Of course, doctors working as employees isn't completely unheard of. If you are worried about consistency, then you absolutely should also be tipping those in that situation, but as tipping on employment arrangements is never expected anywhere, not even where alcohol is sold, there is no onus for you to. It is your life to live. Do what you want.
      - gruez 2y ago
        >By and large doctors operate independent businesses, so you are tipping them. Again, this is a bizarre take. The fact the person is the proprietor of the business doesn't mean you're "tipping" them by mere virtue of patronizing their business. Taxi drivers also operate as independent businesses, but it's a stretch to call the mere fact of paying your bill (ie. without adding anything extra) "tipping".
        randomdata 2y ago
        Any agreement between a patron and a server to exchange an offer of value is also just "paying the bill". Any agreement between the patron and venue is a separate transaction. The law in most jurisdictions makes this quite clear.
        gruez 2y ago
        What does that have to do with your claim that you're "tipping" doctors when you pay exactly what you owe? Or are you living in some bizzaro world where people actually pay doctors extra on top?
        deleted 2y ago
        [deleted]
        deleted 2y ago
        [deleted]
        2y ago
  - KptMarchewa 2y ago
    Another unsolvable problem for US that has been solved... eh, anywhere else?
    - randomdata 2y ago
      There are no countries where tipping is illegal. It is not a solved “problem”. Of course, tipping isn't required anywhere, and that includes the US. If you don't want to tip... don't?
    - kelipso 2y ago
      Haha I find the ridiculous arguments that Americans make to justify whatever insane customs they have somewhat entertaining.
wkrsz 2y ago
I imagine restaurant chains could make this their competitive advantage: "No hidden costs. Service included. No tips expected. What you seen on the menu is the real price" I'd be inclined to choose such a place as a tourist from Europe, who's accustomed to tipping being optional.
- kleinsch 2y ago
  That's not how most people think. JCPenny tried removing discounts and clearance sales so they could say "what you see is the real price" and it was a disaster. Most people aren't doing the mental math to decide what's actually more expensive. https://www.cnn.com/2018/09/27/business/jcpenney-history/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2018/09/27/business/jcpenney-history/ind...

tzs 2y ago

For people that are currently paying 20% tips that's a big win. It doesn't change what they pay but streamlines the process. But for people who are currently not tipping or paying less than 20% it would be a price increase. If the people not tipping or tipping less than 20% were evenly distributed across all age, income, and other demographic groups probably nobody else would care. Unfortunately non-tipping and low tipping is not evenly distributed in the US. That would need to be taken into account.