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It's absolutely crazy they dont have an internal toolkit a la QT that allows them to create performant multiplatform apps. It's really mind boggling. Even thei

It's absolutely crazy they dont have an internal toolkit a la QT that allows them to create performant multiplatform apps. It's really mind boggling. Even their OneDrive uses just QT.

neonsunset 2y ago
They do, there is just no top-down initiative that says "use WinUI with C# or lose your job, make sure to throw out React Native and WebView2 by the end of this quarter". That would at least cover Windows. Or they could force everyone adopt MAUI internally instead, despite its flaws (if you dogfood something heavily, bugs get fixed fast). I find it funny that, unlike OneDrive, iCloud desktop client uses WinUI. But I'm not holding my breath and think that whoever could make this reality was pushed out of the relevant teams or the org as a whole by the time W11 shipped - just look how they killed great OneNote UWP variant. Salvaging the situation would be an improbable miracle.
- pjmlp 2y ago
  In this regard, as already discussed before, it what saddens me that Apple and Google are more willing to double down on their UI stacks, Android and iDevices, than Microsoft. If one of them was at the steering wheel of Longhorn, it would most likely been shipped with its .NET based architecture, improved in later releases, and everyone that wasn't into it, could have looked for a job elsewhere.
- victor106 2y ago
  about WinUI from https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/apps/winui/ https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/apps/winui/ > At this time, there are two generations of WinUI: WinUI 2 for UWP and WinUI in the Windows App SDK (WinUI 3). While both can be used in production-ready apps on Windows 10 and later, each have different development targets. In the Microsoft land it's always utterly confusing to get started. You are always left guessing what choice to make.
  - neonsunset 2y ago
    Seems pretty straightforward to just follow these? https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/apps/winui/winui3/desktop-winui3-app-with-basic-interop https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/apps/winui/winui3/... (not very pretty) https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/apps/windows-dotnet-maui/walkthrough-first-app https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/apps/windows-dotne... (better) In either case, my comment did not concern regular users but MSFT themselves.
    - pjmlp 2y ago
      What those things don't tell, is what is still UWP and is yet to be made available on Win32 land. They also don't tell designer isn't around, like on Forms/WPF/UWP, or how bad the C++ development story is. Forms, WPF and ironically MFC, are the only ones with good tooling, and feature coverage.
  - Rinzler89 2y ago
    >In the Microsoft land it's always utterly confusing to get started. You are always left guessing what choice to make. Not it isn't. What you're pointing out is the PRO of Windows, not a CON. It's why backwards compatibility works so well. If you have a super old app you're still developing, you can keep using that old UI stack, no need to rewrite it on a newer one just for ti to be compatible with the latest Windows release. I feel like most people complainant about the different UI stacks supported by Windows, are not Windows developers but just enjoy pointing it out as if it bothers them somehow through sheer existence even though they never wrote any Windows apps.
    - pjmlp 2y ago
      The Windows developers community are pissed off with how badly WinRT was managed since Windows 8. There is seldom anyone of us that went through that, and will advise anyone to use WinUI 3.0, unless they themselves have a sunken cost into UWP, and need a way out. Quite easy to find out in the endless discussions on the related Github repos.
vitorgrs 2y ago
As far I know, OneDrive doesn't use QT anymore on Windows. It's web iirc (the ui part) + WinUI.

It's absolutely crazy they dont have an internal toolkit a la QT that allows them to create performant multiplatform apps. It's really mind boggling. Even their OneDrive uses just QT.

neonsunset 2y ago

They do, there is just no top-down initiative that says "use WinUI with C# or lose your job, make sure to throw out React Native and WebView2 by the end of this quarter". That would at least cover Windows. Or they could force everyone adopt MAUI internally instead, despite its flaws (if you dogfood something heavily, bugs get fixed fast). I find it funny that, unlike OneDrive, iCloud desktop client uses WinUI. But I'm not holding my breath and think that whoever could make this reality was pushed out of the relevant teams or the org as a whole by the time W11 shipped - just look how they killed great OneNote UWP variant. Salvaging the situation would be an improbable miracle.

pjmlp 2y ago
In this regard, as already discussed before, it what saddens me that Apple and Google are more willing to double down on their UI stacks, Android and iDevices, than Microsoft. If one of them was at the steering wheel of Longhorn, it would most likely been shipped with its .NET based architecture, improved in later releases, and everyone that wasn't into it, could have looked for a job elsewhere.
victor106 2y ago
about WinUI from https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/apps/winui/ https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/apps/winui/ > At this time, there are two generations of WinUI: WinUI 2 for UWP and WinUI in the Windows App SDK (WinUI 3). While both can be used in production-ready apps on Windows 10 and later, each have different development targets. In the Microsoft land it's always utterly confusing to get started. You are always left guessing what choice to make.
- neonsunset 2y ago
  Seems pretty straightforward to just follow these? https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/apps/winui/winui3/desktop-winui3-app-with-basic-interop https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/apps/winui/winui3/... (not very pretty) https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/apps/windows-dotnet-maui/walkthrough-first-app https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/apps/windows-dotne... (better) In either case, my comment did not concern regular users but MSFT themselves.
  - pjmlp 2y ago
    What those things don't tell, is what is still UWP and is yet to be made available on Win32 land. They also don't tell designer isn't around, like on Forms/WPF/UWP, or how bad the C++ development story is. Forms, WPF and ironically MFC, are the only ones with good tooling, and feature coverage.
- Rinzler89 2y ago
  >In the Microsoft land it's always utterly confusing to get started. You are always left guessing what choice to make. Not it isn't. What you're pointing out is the PRO of Windows, not a CON. It's why backwards compatibility works so well. If you have a super old app you're still developing, you can keep using that old UI stack, no need to rewrite it on a newer one just for ti to be compatible with the latest Windows release. I feel like most people complainant about the different UI stacks supported by Windows, are not Windows developers but just enjoy pointing it out as if it bothers them somehow through sheer existence even though they never wrote any Windows apps.
  - pjmlp 2y ago
    The Windows developers community are pissed off with how badly WinRT was managed since Windows 8. There is seldom anyone of us that went through that, and will advise anyone to use WinUI 3.0, unless they themselves have a sunken cost into UWP, and need a way out. Quite easy to find out in the endless discussions on the related Github repos.

vitorgrs 2y ago

As far I know, OneDrive doesn't use QT anymore on Windows. It's web iirc (the ui part) + WinUI.