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500k Books Have Been Deleted from the Internet Archive's Lending Library

53 points by isaacfrond 2y ago

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
AtlasBarfed 2y ago
I hope the backups were mysteriously missing. Or thrown out. On top of a very accessible dumpster.
- account42 2y ago
  I imagine they still have the physical books and just stopped sharing the scans. Not a big loss IMO - they should have ever embraced DRM in the first place.
  - autoexec 2y ago
    They should never have thought they'd need to. It's kind of insane that we have the ability to put the vast majority of the world's knowledge, art, and literature online where everyone can freely access it all instantly yet we hold back the education and cultural enrichment of humanity so that a tiny number of massive corporations can further enrich themselves. Copyright is broken, and it's now acting counter to its original purpose which was to "promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts". 14 years of special protections was considered enough back when printing and publication was a massive expense and worldwide distribution was nearly impossible to achieve, but now that those things are virtually free and happen at the speed of light we have copyrights that last hundreds of years and can be extended forever. The internet archive has been doing the best they can while operating in an intentionally broken system that is designed to prevent them from their goals.
    - taskforcegemini 2y ago
      to be fair, some of that money is used for the curation of current knowledge
      - timschmidt 2y ago
        Studies say the opposite: https://www.law.berkeley.edu/files/How_Copyright_Keeps_Works_Disappeared_-_Paul_Heald.pdf https://www.law.berkeley.edu/files/How_Copyright_Keeps_Works... "A random sample of new books for sale on Amazon.com shows more books for sale from the 1880’s than the 1980’s. Why? This paper presents new data on how copyright stifles the reappearance of works. First, a random sample of more than 2000 new books for sale on Amazon.com is analyzed along with a random sample of almost 2000 songs available on new DVD’s. Copyright status correlates highly with absence from the Amazon shelf. Together with publishing business models, copyright law seems to deter distribution and diminish access. Further analysis of eBook markets, used books on Abebooks.com, and the Chicago Public library collection suggests that no alternative marketplace for out-of-print books has yet developed. Data from iTunes and YouTube, however, tell a different story for older hit songs. The much wider availability of old music in digital form may be explained by the differing holdings in two important cases Boosey & Hawkes v. Disney (music) and Random House v. Rosetta Stone (books)."
    - squigz 2y ago
      Not to minimize anything about what IA is doing, but there's also efforts that say "Fuck the system" and operate outside of it. https://annas-archive.org/ https://annas-archive.org/
      - ForOldHack 2y ago
        So... not to minimze your stand for anarchy, but its the ultimate slap in the face to make a gigantic archive of books in a tar file, so I cannot get the single book I am looking for. Well, that is why we have libraries. The internet Archive is not just the end all-be all, but its a good start. I am also on the uncensored library, and other collections of books. It all does not begin and end with anarchy, but it begins with someone getting pissed off, and mostly ends with reduction-ad-obserdium. Why was this a problem anyway?
        t0bia_s 2y ago
        What do you mean by uncensored library?
ChrisArchitect 2y ago
[dupe] enough with the TechDirt. Actual article: https://blog.archive.org/2024/06/17/let-readers-read/ https://blog.archive.org/2024/06/17/let-readers-read/ Discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40707084 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40707084
Kim_Bruning 2y ago
So the New Library of Alexandria participates in the Internet Archive. 500 000 books removed is an interesting thing to explain in this context.
dooglius 2y ago
The books are marked as unavailable for borrowing, but there's no indication that any deletion has occurred.

53 points by isaacfrond 2y ago

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

AtlasBarfed 2y ago

I hope the backups were mysteriously missing. Or thrown out. On top of a very accessible dumpster.

account42 2y ago
I imagine they still have the physical books and just stopped sharing the scans. Not a big loss IMO - they should have ever embraced DRM in the first place.
- autoexec 2y ago
  They should never have thought they'd need to. It's kind of insane that we have the ability to put the vast majority of the world's knowledge, art, and literature online where everyone can freely access it all instantly yet we hold back the education and cultural enrichment of humanity so that a tiny number of massive corporations can further enrich themselves. Copyright is broken, and it's now acting counter to its original purpose which was to "promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts". 14 years of special protections was considered enough back when printing and publication was a massive expense and worldwide distribution was nearly impossible to achieve, but now that those things are virtually free and happen at the speed of light we have copyrights that last hundreds of years and can be extended forever. The internet archive has been doing the best they can while operating in an intentionally broken system that is designed to prevent them from their goals.
  - taskforcegemini 2y ago
    to be fair, some of that money is used for the curation of current knowledge
    - timschmidt 2y ago
      Studies say the opposite: https://www.law.berkeley.edu/files/How_Copyright_Keeps_Works_Disappeared_-_Paul_Heald.pdf https://www.law.berkeley.edu/files/How_Copyright_Keeps_Works... "A random sample of new books for sale on Amazon.com shows more books for sale from the 1880’s than the 1980’s. Why? This paper presents new data on how copyright stifles the reappearance of works. First, a random sample of more than 2000 new books for sale on Amazon.com is analyzed along with a random sample of almost 2000 songs available on new DVD’s. Copyright status correlates highly with absence from the Amazon shelf. Together with publishing business models, copyright law seems to deter distribution and diminish access. Further analysis of eBook markets, used books on Abebooks.com, and the Chicago Public library collection suggests that no alternative marketplace for out-of-print books has yet developed. Data from iTunes and YouTube, however, tell a different story for older hit songs. The much wider availability of old music in digital form may be explained by the differing holdings in two important cases Boosey & Hawkes v. Disney (music) and Random House v. Rosetta Stone (books)."
  - squigz 2y ago
    Not to minimize anything about what IA is doing, but there's also efforts that say "Fuck the system" and operate outside of it. https://annas-archive.org/ https://annas-archive.org/
    - ForOldHack 2y ago
      So... not to minimze your stand for anarchy, but its the ultimate slap in the face to make a gigantic archive of books in a tar file, so I cannot get the single book I am looking for. Well, that is why we have libraries. The internet Archive is not just the end all-be all, but its a good start. I am also on the uncensored library, and other collections of books. It all does not begin and end with anarchy, but it begins with someone getting pissed off, and mostly ends with reduction-ad-obserdium. Why was this a problem anyway?
      - t0bia_s 2y ago
        What do you mean by uncensored library?

ChrisArchitect 2y ago

[dupe] enough with the TechDirt. Actual article: https://blog.archive.org/2024/06/17/let-readers-read/ https://blog.archive.org/2024/06/17/let-readers-read/ Discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40707084 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40707084

Kim_Bruning 2y ago

So the New Library of Alexandria participates in the Internet Archive. 500 000 books removed is an interesting thing to explain in this context.

dooglius 2y ago

The books are marked as unavailable for borrowing, but there's no indication that any deletion has occurred.